Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Aleks Susak
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. There are a number of sources presented, and clearly the subject meets WP:V, but the consensus here is that the sources are mostly low-quality (blogs, etc) and/or simple mentions. There is not the depth of coverage in high-quality WP:RS to establish WP:N. -- RoySmith (talk) 23:27, 19 February 2018 (UTC)
- Aleks Susak (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)
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Subject does not meet general notability requirements. Meatsgains(talk) 17:39, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Hi, Aleks Susak is a well known designer in Canada. Her clothing is worn by many local celebrities. Hope this helps. Abonzz — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abonzz (talk • contribs) 17:48, 11 February 2018 (UTC) — Note to closing admin: Abonzz (talk • contribs) is the creator of the page that is the subject of this AfD.
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 19:24, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Artists-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 19:24, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 19:24, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fashion-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 19:24, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Canada-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 19:24, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Ontario-related deletion discussions. The Mighty Glen (talk) 19:24, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Huffington Post, La Presse, and Hello Canada references were added, in addition to to Globe and Mail. Also last citation was added as requested. The clothing line is being worn and seen by Canada's fashion elite even though the line is relatively new. A Susak jumpsuit worn by the prime minister's wife at the 2016 Pride parade in Vancouver was seen all over Canada. (see: https://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/fashion-and-beauty/fashion/why-sophie-gregoire-trudeau-is-on-a-mission-to-expose-true-canadian-style/article35461231) The clothes were shown in well known Canadian fashion magazines (see : https://fashionmagazine.com/search/?q=aleks+susak) Thank-you for your time. Abonzz (talk —Preceding undated comment added 20:24, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Huffington Post is not a reliable source. The fact that there are a couple articles that mention her in one sentence of the article is of no help whatsoever. See WP:GNG. She's not notable. Also, please disclose any connection you may have to her.104.163.148.25 (talk) 21:30, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- The Huffington Post has won a Pulitzer so is it possible to explain why it isn't reliable? Couldn't the amount of times the clothes are seen in magazines, etc be counted as notability? And zero connection to subject. Thanks Abonzz
- Please sign your posts, you can read about how to do it here. Also, if you want to write articles that "stick", you need to understand reliable sources and notability. Basically there have to be published independent stories that are in-depth. For this person, the reporting is all very minor name checking, so she fails the notability test. It's your responsibility to read and understand those policies. Arguing every single little statement by other editors will get you nowhere as you clearly have not read and understood those policies.104.163.148.25 (talk) 21:45, 12 February 2018 (UTC)
- I'm genuinely not seeing where there's been a Huffington Post source added to this article at all — and I've checked the edit history as well, so it's not that it got added and then removed, but rather it's that if you intended to add a Huffington Post citation you forgot to actually do it. At any rate, The Huffington Post is kind of a borderline source — it's more reliable than the average Blogspot blog, so it can be used for some additional confirmation of facts, but its content still consists principally of bloggers who are given latitude to write about anything or anybody they want to, so it's not a source that could carry notability all on its own if it were the best source on offer. So, in a nutshell, we'd need to actually see the HuffPo source before we could evaluate how much it helps. And neither The Globe and Mail nor La Presse is helping, either, because both articles just namecheck Aleks Susak's existence within coverage of Sophie Grégoire Trudeau, and neither of them is about Aleks Susak. Passing GNG requires media coverage in which Susak is substantively the subject of the source, not just media coverage of other people which happens to passingly mention that Susak exists. Bearcat (talk) 22:19, 17 February 2018 (UTC)
- The Huffington Post has won a Pulitzer so is it possible to explain why it isn't reliable? Couldn't the amount of times the clothes are seen in magazines, etc be counted as notability? And zero connection to subject. Thanks Abonzz
Speedy DeleteDeleteNumerous sources only mention her in one sentence. Entirely lacks in-depth coverage required for notability.104.163.148.25 (talk) 21:27, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Failure of notability guidelines is not a valid reason for speedy deletion per point 5 of WP:NOTCSD. LinguistunEinsuno 21:59, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Right you are! I was mixing up the "speedy k*ep" language of AfD's with the speedy del*te language.104.163.148.25 (talk) 21:37, 12 February 2018 (UTC)
- Delete. Seems to be fanpage. No real RS. Agricola44 (talk) 13:31, 12 February 2018 (UTC)
- Text was originally added to establish notability. Is it possible to point out exactly what makes it sound like a fanpage so changes can be made? Thanks Abonzz
- Please sign your posts, you can read about how to do it here.104.163.148.25 (talk) 21:41, 12 February 2018 (UTC)
- Text was originally added to establish notability. Is it possible to point out exactly what makes it sound like a fanpage so changes can be made? Thanks Abonzz
- Keep Has received significant coverage from secondary sources.[1][2] I noticed sometimes her name is spelled "Alex Susak." Lonehexagon (talk) 04:30, 13 February 2018 (UTC)
Long back and forth between two users
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104.163.148.25 (talk) 19:27, 13 February 2018 (UTC)
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- Additional source Here are other sources discussing her work.[3][4][5] Lonehexagon (talk) 19:54, 14 February 2018 (UTC)
References
- ^ http://urbanologymag.com/aleks-susak-model-turned-designer/
- ^ http://www.beyondfashionmagazine.com/fashion/artistic-touches-full-spectrum-colours-aleks-susaks-fw17-18-collection/
- ^ http://fusia.ca/aleks-susak-fallwinter-2017-2018-collection/
- ^ https://vitaandmoda.com/2014/11/28/emerging-designer-to-watch-aleks-susak/
- ^ http://www.fashionscissors.net/2014/11/aleks-susak-fashion-show.html
- Those are extremely poor sources. I encourage you to have a look at WP:RS. The first Fusia source is copied from Wikipedia. The second Vitaandmoda source is a blog, (non-RS) and the third is a single person publishing a web page, aka a blog. See the contact page where she says "If you have any questions, ideas, suggestions, job offers or even advice please contact me at xyz@ somethign com" As an example, a set of reliable sources would be a profile in the Toronto Star, another in the Globe and Mail, and one or two others. That would cut it, but all we have for this person is very minor mentions. Minor=trivial. 104.163.148.25 (talk) 05:39, 15 February 2018 (UTC)
- I agree to disagree. I feel like it's well-established that she's notable as a designer with enough coverage to create an article about her. Lonehexagon (talk) 18:56, 15 February 2018 (UTC)
- Those are extremely poor sources. I encourage you to have a look at WP:RS. The first Fusia source is copied from Wikipedia. The second Vitaandmoda source is a blog, (non-RS) and the third is a single person publishing a web page, aka a blog. See the contact page where she says "If you have any questions, ideas, suggestions, job offers or even advice please contact me at xyz@ somethign com" As an example, a set of reliable sources would be a profile in the Toronto Star, another in the Globe and Mail, and one or two others. That would cut it, but all we have for this person is very minor mentions. Minor=trivial. 104.163.148.25 (talk) 05:39, 15 February 2018 (UTC)
- Delete. Fashion designers are not automatically presumed notable just because they exist, but the sources being shown here are not reliable ones for the purposes of getting her over WP:GNG: they are blogs and a piddling Canadian National Enquirer knockoff, not reputable media outlets that count as reliable sources for Wikipedia content. And it's not enough to just assert that she's recognized as a major designer, either — the depth and breadth of reliable source coverage available about her has to attest to her purported majorness. Bearcat (talk) 18:26, 17 February 2018 (UTC)
- New sources were added to the Susak page : Canadian Living magazine, LZXY magazine and Toronto City Life. Here is the Huffington Post article that begins with a description of the Susak outfit: http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2016/08/02/sophie-gregoire-trudeau-vancouver-pride_n_11305254.html Thanks Abonzz (talk) 17:35, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
- That Huffington Post article definitely doesn't assist notability, then. It's not about Aleks Susak, but merely mentions Aleks Susak in the process of being about Sophie Grégoire Trudeau — which cuts no ice toward making Aleks Susak notable. And none of the other new sources you've added to the article help either — City Life and LXRY are blogs, not reliable or notability-supporting sources, and the Canadian Living piece is, yet again, a mere mention of Aleks Susak's existence in a blurb about Sophie Grégoire Trudeau. None of these sources are showing what's required — as I already said, we're not looking for coverage of other people which happens to mention Aleks Susak's name, we're looking for coverage about Aleks Susak herself. She has to be the subject of a source, not just a name present in sources about other subjects, before that source assists in demonstrating her notability, and those sources have to be reliable media outlets and not blogs — so we're still at exactly zero notability-assisting sources. Bearcat (talk) 17:21, 19 February 2018 (UTC)
- New sources were added to the Susak page : Canadian Living magazine, LZXY magazine and Toronto City Life. Here is the Huffington Post article that begins with a description of the Susak outfit: http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2016/08/02/sophie-gregoire-trudeau-vancouver-pride_n_11305254.html Thanks Abonzz (talk) 17:35, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
- Keep, seems to be notable enough for inclusion. Featured in magazine and news articles.--Zoupan 23:46, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
- Being "featured in" magazine and news articles is not a notability pass. Being the subject of newspaper and magazine articles is what's required, and none of the sources being shown here are doing that. Bearcat (talk) 17:21, 19 February 2018 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.