Talk:List of Black Rock Shooter characters

Please discuss any issues regarding non-OVA characters created by Huke, images and information content here before editing as I'm sure everyone would like to avoid an edit war. This mainly pertains to the initial state of the article [1] as opposed to the current which removes the excessive non-free images and non-notable characters. Please read the manual of style for proper formatting and also WP:NOTE for notability concerns.

To address one of the more hot topic issues regarding this article, the non-OVA characters were removed because of notability. Apart from being drawn by Huke, these characters do not appear in any other medium aside web images and art books. All information about them are held down to what they look like and what weapons they use. There is little to no background or story information about these characters and no references to back any of the information. The profile images that were added to compliment the prose were deleted because of improper licensing and absent non-free information. We can't even have that many images as well due to restrictions on non-free image content in articles, especially in character lists which is why group shots are highly preferred. Basically, these characters are unnecessary. Pertaining to Huke, they can be mentioned very briefly in the prose possibly under development or conception. However any information about them should be limited until they play a larger role in the BRS universe. Fox816 (talk) 21:04, 16 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

As an additional note, Mad Doggin 7 seems to believe some characters have inaccurate names. For example, he has continually edited Black Gold Saw to Golden Rock Saw, and Strength to White Rock Strength, and others. Those names are inaccurate, and if those names are used, the page is to be edited accordingly. --97.100.193.48 (talk) 20:48, 17 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

Let's keep in mind good faith as we're all trying to improve this article :) I myself am not sure as to what the accurate names are for the characters aside the main four in the OVA so I can't comment on naming issues. Could you provide some links to some reliable sources with correct translations? This article is also in need of some better references so any help at all is appreciated. Other than that thanks for the help! Fox816 (talk) 22:01, 17 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

I will agree to a mentionable concept addition section that lists other "other world" characters. No pics is ok. Just so long as the names are correct.

As for the Names the reason why so many are incorrect on several sites listing them is because they listed the fanmade names some fans gave them before Huke named them. As such Black Golden Saw is actually called Golden Rock Saw by Huke himself. With the exception of a couple of characters all the characters created by Huke has "rock" in their names and is identified by a color at the front of their names. Black Rock Shooter, Yellow Rock Dagger, Red Rock Dragon Slayer etc... Mad Doggin 7 (talk) 20:12, 22 September 2010 (UTC)MadDogginReply

If you can find reliable sources to the accurate names of these characters then that would be great. Since there appears to be fan-made names floating about we would need references to back everything up. One or two good sources would be good for the mentionable concept addition somewhere in the main BRS article and in the lead prose to this list which is very much needed. I'm trying to work up a lead prose for this article but if anyone else knows and can write that it would be a big help. Fox816 (talk) 03:47, 23 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

The only site that lists the names properly are on Huke's blog site, but that's all in Japanese. Trying to find a site with the proper names in English is next to impossible due to the fanmade names and translation errors, but I'll try. and i don't mean to sound like a noob here but what is a prose? Is it like a title sentence describing what/who the characters basically are? Like "Huke, the creator of Black Rock Shooter, has also made several more characters that were not shown in the OVA but are apart of the "Other World" story." something like that? Mad Doggin 7 (talk) 15:59, 23 September 2010 (UTC)Mad Doggin7Reply

Prose itself refers to just any body of text. The lead, which you can read about here at this link, is what is needed for this article. It acts as basically an overview of what the article is about, very concise and to the point while establishing purpose and context. Some very notable examples are the character lists for Naruto and lists for Bleach, the former of which has reached featured status. If Wiki articles could dream, they would dream about attaining Featured status or earning the title of Good Article. I know...I know...what I just said there sounds rather dorky but it's true :) While Wiki is a compendium of information, there is still a basic structure to be followed and for the most part we're all in some way journalists and researchers looking to get published :D Fox816 (talk)

Here is a page scan from one of Huke's art books, and it cloarly shows BGS in the corner there. And as for STR...--97.100.193.48 (talk) 22:28, 28 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

Neither one of your links work so thus i can onlu say you still have no proof. Although i must say it's hard to find and English site with the correct names. I'm still looking. Mad Doggin 7 (talk) 16:11, 30 September 2010 (UTC)Mad Dogging 7Reply

Right then, another scan of BGS and STR. Those links should work.--97.100.193.48 (talk) 23:46, 16 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

403 forbidden Mad Doggin 7 (talk) 17:28, 19 October 2010 (UTC)Mad Dogging 7Reply

The second link does work. And how about this?--68.204.17.249 (talk) 00:14, 13 November 2010 (UTC)Reply

Sorry, that is NOT on of Huke's drawings. that is a fanmade pic. Huke has never drawn GRS with a clawed hand like that. Mad Doggin 7 (talk) 21:40, 2 December 2010 (UTC)Mad DogginReply

I would like to request and auto unedit script be put onto this page. people keep changing the names to the mistranslated names. the unedit script should change all names back to their original names and send a warning to the people who changed it. Mad Doggin 7 (talk) 17:35, 10 December 2010 (UTC)Mad_DogginReply

Hello, I am the creator of the Wikia site for Black Rock Shooter, AND the most recent editor of the BRS Character List. There has been NO confirmations by huke himself that Golden Rock Saw and White Rock Strength are official; if so, why hasn't it been edited accordingly in the Japanese Wikipedia article on BRS? (http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%83%96%E3%83%A9%E3%83%83%E3%82%AF%E2%98%85%E3%83%AD%E3%83%83%E3%82%AF%E3%82%B7%E3%83%A5%E3%83%BC%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC) Also, here are some snippets from the BRS Phenomenon book recently released.

Also, Mad Doggin's assumptions that the images presented are fan art are wrong. The picture of Strength is part of the BRS Phenomenon book, which includes character drawings, and Black Gold Saw's picture is actually a scanned image. Herald of meridian (talk) 00:38, 21 January 2011 (UTC)Reply

I changed the names back to how they were presented for the past year, at no point have I ever seen HUKE refer to BGS or STR as the names Mad Doggin 7 insist they are. He/she is coming off as someone new to the BRS universe. Black Gold Saw's arm is indeed skeletal in appearance, whether by a gauntlet or her actual arm, that part is unclear but that is indeed HUKEs design. White Rock Strength, in my opinion, is a fan name since using "Black" and "Rock" for inspired Original character is rather common. I searched HUKE's blog, art accounts, and saw figure titles, and every time the names were in the order BGS (ブラック ゴールドソー) and STR (ストレングス)... there is no Golden or White Rock anything. Unicogirl (talk) 22:34, 26 January 2011 (UTC)Reply

To the people who have not been able to find Huke's blog article saying the names are incorrect you won't find then on his public blog, but his private blog that he has for his friends to look at. This blog was linked to one of our Moderators and confirmed by her earlier this month. In it it indeed says that Huke can't beleive so many people have gotten Golden Rock Saw's name incorrect. But he also says he won't complain about it anymore. As for White Rock Strength his blog says that Strength or STR is her nick name. Her full name is White Rock Strength. Since Wikipedia doesn't list Nick names as full names we are inclined to put their full name. Fox816 (talk)Comment added by Mad Doggin 7, as evidenced by the page's history. N419BH 07:00, 13 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Until one of you (and this invisible Moderator) can actually prove this blog entry exist then it will just be called fanmade hearsay. Why would HUKE call Black Gold Saw ブラック★ゴールドソー on this artwork, mention her as Black Gold Saw or Gold Saw-(honorific) in interviews and various others media and then later alter it to something else without telling the fanbase? Not only that but also complaining about it?

What purpose is there in keeping it private? If the information on the two characters is incorrect and even the Japanese fanbase apparently isn't aware of it, then why can't you provide anything? To say he was complaining about something that he can fix simply by publicly stating it, is just unbelievable. Unicogirl (talk) 05:35, 30 January 2011 (UTC)Reply

Give us the proof then, Fox816. I and the entire Black★Rock Shooter Wiki will be awaiting the link for huke's private blog. Otherwise, I shall assume you are defending Mad Doggin 7 and his rule-breaking practices. Such practices are unacceptable. Herald of meridian (talk) 07:43, 30 January 2011 (UTC)Reply

I'm going to wait a few more days until one of them proves their findings, if nothing comes up I am changing the names back to how they are originally named when HUKE drew them and then getting a Wikipedia staff to end this. Unicogirl (talk) 20:27, 31 January 2011 (UTC)Reply

I do believe there is a reason why it's called a "PRIVATE BLOG." And it's not smart of you guys to back talk Fox816. He is a moderator of Wikipedia and he can easily block you guys. I for one trust his sources. Mad Doggin 7 (talk) 15:44, 1 February 2011 (UTC)Mad DogginReply

But still, "Encyclopedic content must be verifiable," so you have to make huke's private blog public. Otherwise, you have to undo your revisions. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Herald of meridian (talk • contribs) 00:34, 2 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Neither of you have provided any validation besides text. And Mad Doggin 7 you're the one who made the changes yet now you are saying Fox816 is the source? We are not back talking to Fox816, we are Asking For Proof based on your constant editing to names that only show up on fan pages when Googled. At no point do these names result in a Japanese page, not one, the results have largely been English and Spanish. As a Wikipedia Moderator- Fox816 should know better than to the hold information that would benefit an article. If you don't want to provide a link, screen cap, or a Japanese page where these names have turned up, then it is up to Wikipedia staff to settle it. Unicogirl (talk) 02:28, 3 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Please do not let Mad Doggin 7 mislead you, everyone. Fox816 is not a Wikipedia administrator. Please see: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:ListUsers/sysop&limit=2000. Fox816 is not among those listed. This misrepresentation of user priviledges is unacceptable behavior as of Wikipedia policy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:TPNO#Behavior_that_is_unacceptable. Threatening with such methodology is explicitly prohibitted. You are treading on dangerous territory outside the lines of proper conduct here already, and could be reported for that alone, Mad Doggin 7.

Further, it is outright misinformation that huke says what you say he says. On his very own Pixiv account, on the very first image where this character is introduced, it is clearly labeled: "ブラック★ゴールドソー" (Black Gold Saw): http://www.pixiv.net/member_illust.php?mode=medium&illust_id=384869 (may need a free Pixiv account to view). On his blog, and in officially given interviews and commentary published by official commercial franchise licensors, such as the Black Rock Shooter Phenomenon book, he has consistently referred to her explicitly as either "ブラック★ゴールドソー" (Black Gold Saw) or just "ゴールドソー" (Gold Saw), with no mention of any misrepresentation of her name. The official license holder and promoter of the Black Rock Shooter franchise, Good Smile Company, has explicitly stated that the English transliteration is "Black Gold Saw", both on their English website: http://www.goodsmile.info/product/en/3060/Black+Gold+Saw+-+animation+version-.html, and in official Japanese publications.

Nowhere do these supposed Japanese names appear in any official publication, or any Japanese website for that matter. Not only have you changed your story, but the original "Japanese name" you posted: "ゴールデン★ロックは見た"　is completely nonsensical, and no actual Japanese speaker would ever use the discourse topic marker "は" (ha/wa) in a non-discourse context, such as a name, as it is completely meaningless as such. Even if a "Saw" were a verb, the only way it could be used in a nominal (noun) context would be as a relative clause. Further, the romanization you have provided for your new supposed Japanese name is completely contradictory to any standardized romanization system for Japanese kana, and is a gross misrepresentation of the standard pronunciation of Japanese kana. No one who has ever studied Japanese would ever write it as such.

Mad Doggin 7, I am obligated to warn you that you are in multiple violations of Wikipedia policy: false claims of user priviledges and threatening with those false claims, multiple, unilateral edits and reverts in defiance of community concensus, contradicting officially provided sources with unsourced, unverifiable information while refusing to provide evidence, misrepresention of standardized subjects, and adding unprofessional commentary to Wikipedia articles. Consider this your warning to cease this behavior, or you will be reported to Wikipedia administration for disruptive editing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Disruptive_editing, explicit violations of Wikipedia policy, and lowering the overall quality of Wikipedia articles. CannikinX (talk) 02:40, 5 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Mad Doggin 7, despite these warnings you continue to persist in this nonsense. If you believe you can hide behind an alternate IP address (65.254.165.214) you are mistaken; a cursory overview of that address' edit history obviously reveals that you are clearly the same person.

I believe this has gone on more than long enough. I have no choice but to report your disruptive behavior to Wikipedia administration. Please see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents under thread: "Disruptive Behavior by User: Mad Doggin 7 / 65.254.165.214" CannikinX (talk) 00:10, 11 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Despite this being a low concern article, I hope the Wikipedia admins do something about this silly edit war. Heck, I can't even call it a war more of edit nuisance. Unicogirl (talk) 00:35, 11 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

For the sake of being civil here, I will try to be patient here. Why in the hell are you impersonating me Mad Doggin 7? If anyone here checks the HISTORY of this page, I have NOT made an edit here since September 24 2010. Explain to me THIS EDIT http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:List_of_Black_Rock_Shooter_characters&diff=410621620&oldid=410254409 and why you, Mad Doggin 7, signed MY NAME for it. I will not help you since you are falsely throwing my name around as yours to advance your argument. My status holds no higher or lower weight than anyone else's. You will be reported for this. Fox816 (talk) 05:57, 13 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Just another item in the long list of violations by Mad Doggin 7. I seriously don't know what he's trying to accomplish here. He just keeps digging his hole deeper. Thanks for clearing this up Fox816, it only makes the case against him all that much stronger (as if it wasn't already enough). I never really suspected you (didn't make any direct accusation towards you), as something definitely seemed suspicious. Now I know to look even deeper into the edit history next time for more evidence. CannikinX (talk) 07:18, 13 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

As I said before, my apologies to Fox816. I rarely check Talk Page history because impersonation is not on my mind upon using these pages. I hope this person becomes blocked, I got around to checking their name and IP contributes and pretty much consist of troll editing. Unicogirl (talk) 21:24, 15 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

(edit conflict) 1. A blog is generally not a reliable source. 2. A "private blog" is not a verifiable source 3. Impersonating other users is a serious matter. Fox816 is not a administrator, nor has he ever claimed to be. We don't have "moderators" here, Mad Doggin 7, we have admins, and they handle blocking. Furthermore, real admins do not use their tools to win content disputes by blocking the opposition or threatening the opposition with blocks. With these points in mind, would all of you please work to find reliable sources for the names of these characters? If you can't find any, you may have to use both names, possibly in order of popularity. Just to be clear, I am not an admin either. Admins are regular editors with extra tools. I'm a regular editor without extra tools offering my opinions and advice while linking to Wikipedia's relevant policies and guidelines. N419BH 07:19, 13 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

An investigation through search engines reveals that all the (very few) results for the supposed names by Mad Doggin 7 are on English (or at least non-Japanese) pages and stem directly or indirectly from Mad Doggin 7 himself, either by being posted directly by himself (under a similar name "Mad Dog"), or as a result of pulling from this very Wikipedia page carrying his misinformation. There are no Japanese websites that mention either of his supposed Japanese names at all. Thus there is no "popularity" of these names. All usage ultimately stems from Mad Doggin 7 himself. CannikinX (talk) 07:42, 13 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

I seriously don't know how these fake names got started, all of them are around last year during the summer by various people, but who knows, perhaps MadDoggin had a hand in influencing others into spreading it. You can definitely find White Rock Strength/Fist since people just like the color/rock/characteristic here aspect of the series, but you will not find one mention of that name on Japanese sites, HUKEs artbook or figures of the character. As stated these names largely turn up English and Spanish pages. Unicogirl (talk) 21:24, 15 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Mad Doggin 7 has been placed under an indefinite block, and his IP address under a 1 month block. Hopefully this ends this sad little episode permanently. Just in case, though, be on the look out for any suspicious activity (especially after the 1 month block on the IP expires), as he has shown that he is willing to use extremely underhanded tactics to get his way, and has a tendency towards repeat offenses. CannikinX (talk) 23:15, 15 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Just put up something on Hanako Nakamura from the manga. If anyone's curious about where I got the kanji from, that would be from the Mangafox scan.

Also redid the names of the Apostles to the "unpronounceable" names based on the website. If this may not have been the best move, feel free to revert that.--68.204.17.28 (talk) 20:00, 18 September 2011 (UTC)Reply