Talk:Ploutonion at Hierapolis

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This is a meaningless word, and not a proper noun when referring to antiquity. The religious affiliations of this site are known. It was a cult site for Cybele, whose mysteries were sometimes in Greek practice connected to initiatory cults such as the Eleusinian Mysteries (that's the link to Pluto). Because it was a dream oracle, in the Roman Imperial era it was incorporated into Imperial religious practices pertaining to Apollo as a god of prophecy (whom Augustus adopted as a patron). From the Pluto article:

The ploutonion at Hierapolis, Phrygia, was connected to the rites of Cybele, but during the Roman Imperial era was subsumed by the cult of Apollo, as confirmed by archaeological investigations during the 1960s. It too was a dream oracle.<ref>Frederick E. Brenk, "Jerusalem-Hierapolis. The Revolt under Antiochos IV Epiphanes in the Light of Evidence for Hierapolis of Phrygia, Babylon, and Other Cities," in ''Relighting the Souls: Studies in Plutarch, in Greek Literature, Religion, and Philosophy, and in the New Testament Background'' (Franz Steiner, 1998), pp. 382–384.</ref>

Note that a source published in 1998 was aware that this ploutonion had been explored by archaeologists in the 1960s. The article needs scholarly sources that meet standards of RS for this topic, not just journalists reporting on archaeologists who quite forgivably want to excite the public and stir up funding. Cynwolfe (talk) 12:42, 2 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Does the article's creator have any intention of addressing this rather major problem? Otherwise, the article needs one of those scary-looking tag for "Factual accuracy disputed". Cynwolfe (talk) 12:59, 3 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The fatal gases emanating from that location are well known to the locals. I was told about it when I visited a few years ago. There's a sign saying "'Tehlikelidir Zehirli Gaz' (Dangerous Poisonous Gas). Lonely Planet describes this: http://www.lonelyplanet.com/turkey/aegean-coast/pamukkale/sights/ruin/plutonium. 206.47.245.252 (talk) 13:42, 3 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Per the quote and citation above, and the absence of a response, I'm tagging the article for factual accuracy. The site seems to have been discovered and explored for decades. Cynwolfe (talk) 16:57, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Since you're not disputing the accuracy of the article as a whole, just the accuracy of specific facts, I feel that the inline templates are sufficient. I've therefore removed your tag. You are, of course, welcome to make appropriate corrections to this article, provided they conform to WP policy. 2602:100:4759:4D52:1126:2EAE:8A4:A54C (talk) 08:44, 11 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Since I wasn't the one who chose to create an article about this topic, I was hoping the person who did would be motivated to look beyond journalistic sources into some actual scholarship. I've contributed quite a lot of content to Wikipedia, so I'm not the one who needs the note about doing so appropriately and in conformity with policy. I provided a source above that indicates the site has been explored since the 1960s. It's a pretty big error to state otherwise and to imply that's an element of notability, and if I created an article, I would want to look into it. I can do so myself, but wanted to give the creator a chance before barging in. Cynwolfe (talk) 12:21, 11 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, settle down there Cynwold, you eager guy you, references linked. I just returned from a vacation in Turkey, visited the site and thought it was neat, created a Wiki article. Apparently the 2013 excavations are important because they found the definite opening of the gate (hence the media hype of events) and they were able to reconstruct it digitally which has never been done before. There are no references to this online though so we will just have to bear it in mind and fix it if and when such sources become available, most likely upon the publishing of the archaeological dig's findings.- Clark Sui (talk) 01:42, 12 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I cleaned up the article to use named references, now the source is much more conveniently readable. I also removed some double references: many news reports said the same thing as the report by Discovery News. Still, the references don't cover all the claims: I've added citation needed templates at those spots. Specifically, I haven't been able to find a source for the claims that the Galli crawled over the floor to survive the gas and the 2,000 square metres figure. I think there still is a lot of rewriting to be done, and I'm going to send some e-mails to D'Andria to ask if there is a scientific publication on the recent discovery which can be used as a source for this article. --AlexanderVanLoon (talk) 10:20, 30 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Also, I think it would be nice to have a schematic map of Hierapolis which shows the lcoation of the ploutonion relative to the city. The current map of Turkey is not so useful, people can already see the location of Hierapolis in its own article. --AlexanderVanLoon (talk) 10:24, 30 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

• Pfanz, Hardy; Yüce, Galip; Gulbay, Ahmet H.; Gokgoz, Ali (2018). "Deadly CO2 gases in the Plutonium of Hierapolis (Denizli, Turkey)". Archaeological and Anthropological Sciences. doi:10.1007/s12520-018-0599-5.