Talk:Medellín: Difference between revisions

We currently write about Medellín without even mentioning drugs or violence. This seems wrong to me. -- Jmabel | Talk 20:05, May 24, 2005 (UTC)

This is article is missing many important facts like Medellin is the "murder capital" and the Cartel de Medellin -- Elpaisa1 (5 Dec 2005)

Why we have to point out always the negative!! (Raniya 22:44, 9 December 2005 (UTC))[reply]

its the truth im from Medellin and don't tell me its wrong or not what to write this in an encyclopedia - Elpaisa1

Because we are an encyclopedia, not a travel brochure. Just like the article on Seattle, where I live, mentions its history of a boom-and-bust economy, and the fact that about 1.5% of its population is homeless. -- Jmabel | Talk 01:59, 11 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The history part is really bad. It actually has nothing to do with the real history... There is not a word on its foundation (founder, dates, native tribes...). There isn't a mention on Medellin's developement and the facts that made it grew and snatched the capital from Santafé de Antioquia. The violence and drugs part is actually wrote with anger, not objective as an encyclopedia. It happened but it is not half the history of the city. It is a BIG lie Medellin has the biggest homicide rate. In 2004 the anual homicide rate was 60 per 100.000 habs, as compared to 133 of Caracas(Ven), 92 of Cali (Col) or 62 of Washington (USA). In 2005 the rate in Medellín has dropped other 34% but there isn't a comparison available yet --slayer 00:00, 4 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Slayer, Medellin no longer has the highest recorded homicide rate and the article never said it did. However, you can't deny that it certainly holds the world record from the early 90's of any reasonably sized city. Around 300 murders per 100,000 of a city which then had just over 2 million people.

That murder rate for Caracas is often quoted yet almost certainly false. The real rate is probably somewhere between 50 to 100 per 100,000 across a city of 4.6 million.

Again and not for the first time, Washington D.C.'s murder statistics and violence levels have been exaggerated. D.C.'s murder rate in 2004 was 37 per 100,000 - almost half of what you claimed, slayer. You also have to remember that Washington is a city of only half a million people so the murder rate is actually inflated anyway. Medellin's murder rate [apart from the last couple of years] is normally much higher and it's spread across a city that's several times the size.

If there is a big lie then it's Washington's WAY more widespread reputation as 'the murder capital of the world', and the severe underreporting of Medellin's far worse homicide epidemic. Just compare the two pages on this site. The D.C. page has a whole crime section which goes into detail about the cities' homicide levels. - Serbitar

Serbitar: I found the new version a little bit better but my main goal was to correct the false statements that appeared in the article, not to discuss the crime in Washington... The data that I got was published in newspapers. BTW: It sounds funny that you claim Washington has only half a million, but in this site the metropolitan area of Washington is 4'190.000 without Baltimore.

I won't go further in this thread but remember, the main hospitals are located in Medellin, and many deaths are critical patients sent from the whole metropolitan area. And I also don't know which is your basis to stablish homicide rate in Medellín is underreported and Caracas data is also wrong.

To whom I believe to be Slayer: Aaah....the old excuses come out for Medellin being so violent once again. The reality is that Medellin's murder rate would barely change if the patients were attacked right near the hospital. I've seen gunshot and stab victims in Medellin hospitals and it's incredible how many who come in that actually survive.

I forgot to mention the small matter that Medellin city proper is actually more violent than outer Medellin.

Yes, Medellin is underreported. How often do you see Medellin violence reported on the news?? I don't know what news channel you watch but let me know so I can see for myself. I've lost count of the news items and documentaries on Los Angeles gangs/American gun violence I've seen over the years.

It is funny that you point out that Washington's population is just under 5 million because the murder rate is taken from the 'city itself' which has a population of around half a million, man. You may be right about the Caracas statistics as they're possibly taken from the city proper which has a population of 1.8 million rather than the metro area. Then again I'm still not sure as Latin American murder rates normally are for the metropolitan region but I've heard it is for the city itself.

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It´s really irrelevant to write about drug cartels, etc.. ; we should mention how Medellín is today and not 15 years ago. The history would be so terrible. Nowadays Medellín is the most progressive city in Colombia (Metro,...). It´s true that there was a high criminality rate, but this was around 1990 when Escobar was alive. Now the criminality rate is under the average of a latinamerican city. Many things changed, especially when Alvaro Uribe became president. Now you can move around entire Medellín without being afraid, even at night. As well as in the whole country. So it´s important to change your mind on 2006 and not on 1990. yussef90 13:24, June 04, 2006 (CET)

I'm a bit baffled by Yussef here. You can't ignore the history of the city dude, that's what Wikipedia's all about. Medellin still has a lot of murders (STILL more dangerous than the city of Los Angeles in it's worst years - fact!) but it has gone down enormously which I have pointed out. Medellin's worst time was 1991 to 1993 and the vast majority of murders Escobar had nothing to do with anyway. I'm slightly surprised you say you can move around the whole of Medellin and Colombia at night without feeling afraid, I find that hard to believe. And don't tell me you can't do that in Los Angeles or any number of other American cities?? *rolls eyes* Things are a lot better though I agree. Serbitar 05:33, June 20, 2006

Someone recently removed the remark that Medellín is Colombia's "main industrial center". Does someone have a citation one way or the other? -- Jmabel | Talk July 6, 2005 04:13 (UTC)

Medellin is Colombia's 3th main industrial center after Bogota and Cali -- Elpaisa1 (5 Dec 2005)

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Wikipedia in Spanish states that Medellin is the second largest city, how come in English is the third largest? (Raniya 22:52, 9 December 2005 (UTC))[reply]

There seems to be a edit war between the wikipedians of Medellín against the other Colombian wikipedians on this, but it will be settled soon as there's a census going on in all Colombia. Sorry about my English.--Nicanor5 05:09, 10 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hey,there isn´t a war between the wikipedians of Medellín and the other Colombian wikipedians, it´s between the wikipedians from Medellín and Cali. I´m from Pereira and I support the truth that Medellín is the 2nd biggest! yussef90 14:17, 04 June 2006 (CET)

The truth is: Medellín as a municipality is the third after Bogotá and Cali, but as a metropolitan area is the 2nd because there are 10 cities in the same area totally united. Cali, on the other hand, has only Yumbo and Jamundí as metropolitan area. In terms of economics, Medellín has been known as an industrial city, mainly for the textile industry. --slayer 00:00, 4 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

According to DANE, the projected city population for 2005 is 2,093,624. Where is the 3.2 million figure for the city from? Also, adding up the 2005 population figures for the 10 municipalities in the official metropolitan area only results in about 3.2 million (see Valle de Aburra official website). I will change the figures unless someone has an official source for the 3.2/3.8 instead of 2.1/3.2. Polaron 02:32, 2 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Please help me adding information about the economy of medellin!! if you discussed facts before maybe you should put them in the article, it will not do any good if it stays in the discussion page when they've been answered... I'm going to add what I know about Medellin's economy but correct me if I'm wrong.. --Don Quijote's Sancho 05:28, 30 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

A city, also called a downtown is the core of a metropolitan area. in this respect you can quote Milan having just 1.5 Million inhabitants while the city you find to your eyes is around 5 million inhabitants. How's that possible? simple, a modern city is composed by downtown areas, other adjacent urban areas and even sub-urban areas. I'm using the same data you are providing and the downtown has a 2+ million inhabitants... however, if you know medellin, you just require physically one step to go from Medellin municipality to itagui municipality or to bello monucipality and so with other municipalities within the metropolitan area...

So while refering to cities dimmensions, metropolitan areas more than downtowns are the factors to take in consideration... if not, you'd say rome is bigger than milan just comparing the downtowns... (just comparing two cities that are known and not to make use of clasical comparissons with LA or NY)... C trillos

Using metro area figures for city populations is misleading. Why not just say 3rd largest city and 2nd largest metropolitan area? This way is is not ambiguous. If the article is about the entire metropolitan area then we could emphasize the metro area figure. Otherwise, we can mention it but emphasize the administrative area figure. Is the article about the city or the entire metropolitan area? Polaron 22:06, 2 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think, we can go as you say... the issue is ranking the cities according to the population.... we can do it as you say third city and second metropolitan area (in fact medellin is a bigger urban area than cali because of the metropolitan area).... Notice in every city article the metropolitan area is worth the mention.... please make the change yourself but over the current revision, not simply reverting... C trillos

wikipedias's definition of metropolitan area: "A metropolitan area is a large population center consisting of a large city and its adjacent zone of influence, or of several neighboring cities or towns and adjoining areas, with one or more large cities serving as its hub or hubs".

If this definition is truth then the Cali's metropolitan area should have cities like Buga, Palmira, Yumbo, Jamundi, Guacari, Pradera, etc., even Puerto Tejada and Santander de Quilichao in the Cauca department, because a lot of people in those cities travel everyday to Cali to work, study, etc. The sum of the population of those cities is bigger than 3.4 million so you can't keep saying that Medellin's metropolitan area is bigger than Cali's.

Everybody knows that Cali has a metropolitan area the problem is that it has not been officially defined.

There is an official urban area definition which includes just the municipalities of Cali, Yumbo and Jamundi. There is some intervening rural territory between this area and some of the other areas you mentioned. The Medellin urban area is definitely larger than Cali's. Polaron 23:27, 2 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well Polaron could you please give us a link with an official definition of the METROPOLITAN (not urban) AREA of Cali with it's cities? because wikipedia can not be based upon what you guess but on real facts and as far a I know there is not an official definition yet. Meanwhile you can not say that Medellin's metropolitan area is bigger than Cali's.

According to the sources cited in the article [1]

for medellin population, [2] for Cali's population, and having taking in consideration that a metropolitan area is an administrative area Clearly and legally defined (the description of the municipalities that are part of each metropolitan area can be found in [3])

we have:

this clearly shows the urban center defined by Valle de Aburra's Metropolitan area (Medellin's metropolitan area) is bigger than that from Cali. C trillos

The most authoritative sources I could find are this bulletin from the Cali goverment and this note regarding the jurisdiction of the Cali Metropolitan Police. DANE has a Cali-Yumbo metropolitan area but I couldn't find what municipalities they include. So it looks like the included municipalities are: Cali, Candelaria, Jamundí, La Cumbre, Vijes, Yumbo. The 2005 DANE estimate of the total population from here is 2,645,332. This is still definitely smaller than the official Valle De Aburra metropolitan area. Polaron 17:00, 3 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Medellín is the second biggest in everything , very easy! yussef90 13:31, June 04, 2006 (CET)