Talk:Hiligaynon language: Difference between revisions

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Elaborating on my revert... I took a look at 140.118.160.223's source which I quote:

The province of Aklan speaks Aklanon which, like Hiligaynon, developed from Kinaray-a.

Though distinctly different from Hiligaynon, Kinaray-a and Aklanon are conveniently considered by many linguists and literary researchers as subsumed in the lingua franca. Current writers in Kinaray-a and Aklanon have shown that it is not so.

I am not sure where the idea came from that Hiligaynon comes from Kinaray-a. This is a misconception that is spread by Karay-a writers like Alex de los Santos. Taking a look at language trees, one will find that Hiligaynon is more closely related to other Central Visayan languages like Waray-Waray and Romblomanon. Kinaray-a and Aklanon, on the other hand, are of the West Visayan branch and are related to Onhan of Romblon province.

Furthermore, I object to the statement saying that linguists assume that Kinaray-a and Aklanon are from Hiligaynon. The several Philippine linguists I am acquainted with do not believe this idea. --Chris S. 00:59, 3 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Does anyone know if there is a Hiligaynon or Ilonggo wikipedia in existence? (since it is the 4th largest native language which is spoken by 7 million people in the Philippines). --Jose77, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

No, there isn't any. There are Wikis in Tagalog, Cebuano, Kapampangan, and Ilokano, though. Also, there is a stalled request for a Kinaray-a encyclopedia - there is a lack of native speakers. I'd love to see a Hiligaynon one, though. --Chris S. 21:11, 28 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, I think someone has nominated for one. Just check Metawiki:Requests for new languages 23prootie 22:33, 16 June 2006 (UTC)23prootie[reply]

The Hiligaynon Test Wikipedia can now be found Here alongside the other Incubation Wikipedias. Writers and Articles are needed though.

--Jose77 22:04, 27 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Please help translate and contribute to the Hiligaynon Wikipedia. by signing up at http://translatewiki.net Madamu gid nga Salamat! :) --Tagimata (talk) 16:37, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The request for Hiligaynon Wikipedia has now been verified as eligible

This means that after these 1832 interface messages have been translated into Hiligaynon, then the Test-project will qualify for Final Approval. To translate those system messages, follow these steps. --Jose77 (talk) 22:38, 13 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I do not speak Hiligaynon, so my edits should be thuroughly reviewed by others. I used http://www.omniglot.com/writing/hiligaynon.htm as my source for the alphabet.. Note that the pronounciation of sy is missing.. I couldnt quite read the IPA in the gif i used as a source. I hope someone can fix that.

I'm vague in places, because I really do not know.. I figure my contributions may have value as a starting point in spite of this.

My girlfriend writes "ma'yong aga". I notice other sources say "maayong aga". Is it even proper to refer to it as an apostrophe in this context?

~~ LordBrain 11:11, 27 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Maayong aga is the formal version, ma'yong aga would be the informal version, equivalent to a contraction, like "what's" instead of "what is", or "don't" instead of "do not". — • Kurt Guirnela • ‡ ^Feedback 03:13, 14 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Some sources say they are the same language, but others say there is a slight difference... It's interesting to note what is said on Negros Occidental. Perhaps Ilonggo is a dialect of Hiligaynon? One which is more spanish influenced? --LordBrain 12:45, 27 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Despite knowing a dozen or so people from Bacolod, and asking a few filipino wikipedians, I can't find a definitive answer to this either. I think they are two dialects of the same language. My bacolod friends say they can't understand the Hiligaynon spoken in Ilo ilo because there are words used there that aren't used by Bacolod filipinos, but when someone from bacolod is talking with someone from Ilo ilo, they speak Ilonggo/Hiligaynon (rather than a lingua franca such as Tagalog or English). Gronky 10:10, 28 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The thing is that Negros is not only inhabited by Ilonggo/Hiligaynon-speaking people but that it also is by Bisaya(also known as Cebuano, mostly located in southern part) and Hiniraya(kinaray-a, mostly residing in the mountainous area). Negros people of north sometimes find a hard time communicating with the southern-most. As to Iloilo people, their territory, which is about 1/3 part and one of districts of Panay, is not even quite occupied by their fellows; Hiniraya-speakers is more dominant even within their boundary. Including the fact that the three other districts have their unique and challenging-to-comprehend dialects that influence much. One may not quite relate it if one is not living in one of the islands--Negros and Panay. Each vocabulary is, i believed, progressing to their different extents. Ironically, Negros people recognizes deeply of their local vocabulary whereas Iloilo ones usually tend to rely on foreign loanwords. Likum (talk • contribs) 09:42, 31 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Probably the reason why people from negros cant understand people from Iloilo is because of the influence from Kinaray-a spoken by a lot of people from Iloilo. From what I know through, Hiligaynon from Iloilo and from Negros are virtually identical, discounting possible influence from kinaray-a. Also regarding whether the language is properly called Ilonggo or Hiligaynon has not been concluded yet. My guess is that the difference between Ilonggo and Hiligaynon is like the difference between Espanol and Castellano (Spaniards prefer to call the language Castellano because there are other languages spoken in Spain while people in Latin America probably refer to the language as Espanol)Richarddr1234, August 25, 2008 —Preceding undated comment was added at 05:41, 25 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hiligaynon and Ilonggo are synonymous with each other. However, that always wasn't so. Ilonggo used to refer specifically to the people and language of Iloilo, but the name has since broadened to mean Hiligaynon. Ilonggo still refers to an ethnic group, too, though. --Chris S. 16:41, 28 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I just spoke to one friend from Bacolod about this. She says that Ilonggo is the name of what is spoken in Negros Occidental (including Bacolod), and in Iloilo city. She said that Hiligaynon is the name of what is spoken outside of Iloilo city. She said she can understand some Hiligaynon because her grandmother knew Hiligaynon, but most people in Bacolod can't understand Hiligaynon. She said that Hiligaynon is mostly spoken by older generations, it's more common now to learn Ilonggo because it's the language of Iloilo. She also said there are at least two other languages in that area, one called karay-a and she didn't know the other's name. I'll talk to more friends from Bacolod about this later or in the coming days. Gronky 18:07, 28 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I just spoke to two others from Bacolod and they agreed with the above and just added that the number of Hiligaynon speakers is in decline because the new generation are mostly learning Ilonggo, and karay-a is also called kinaray-a.Gronky 19:06, 28 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Speakers of the Hiligaynon/Ilonggo do not themselves know the difference between the two terms. From Teodoro Llamzon's book, one will read that Hiligaynon and Ilonggo are just two different terms for one language. Hiligaynon, however, is exclusively used to refer to the language, while Ilonggo also refers to the people. It should be noted, however, that there is one scholar, F. Landa Jocano, who forwards the idea that the term Hiligaynon also refers to a specific group of people. He used it as the title of his book "The Hiligaynons." Still, no one else has used the term to refer to the people of Iloilo and its neighbors. --emanlerona 15:39:09, 20 November 2006

But this isn't what we're talking about here. Here we are only concerned with the languages, not any other meanings of the words "Ilonggo" or "Hiligaynon". Gronky 09:40, 21 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

So the issue is resolved then. Hiligaynon and Ilonggo (as names for [the] language) are one and the same.--emanlerona 08:52, 22 November 2006

Unfortunately, the issue has not yet been resolved. The issue seems to not have a simple answer. Linguist experts disagree with first-hand answers from laypeople. The current state of the debate is on this page. Gronky 23:01, 23 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

In linguistic literature, you will find that Hiligaynon also includes that of Iloilo city. Usually descriptions by lay persons will vary. In any case, I will quote a passage from Dr. R. David Zorc, a linguist who has been studying Philippine languages (especially those in the islands of Panay and Negros) for over forty years:

Location: Hiligaynon is spoken in the Philippines throughout Negros Occidental (the western half of the island of Negros), the eastern and southern portions of Panay Island, and most of Guimaras Island, and by immigrants in large pockets on Mindanao (e.g., the Davao area) and Palawan (in and around Puerto Princesa).

Dialects: Hiligaynon has many dialects. For example, the alternate language name Ilonggo originally referred only to the dialect of Iloilo City. Almost every town, especially those along language borders with CEBUANO, Kinaray-a and Aklanon, has some variation in lexicon and intonation. Those dialects which have notable differences include Capiznon (which is spoken in Capiz Province on central eastern Panay; it has several lexical idiosyncrasies) and Kawayan (which is spoken in the town of Cauayan, south of Bacolod City on Negros; it has a phonological idiosyncracy wherein an [l] between vowels is often replaced by a [y], e.g., Hil ulán, Kaw uyán ‘rain’).

In any case, Iloilo has always been a Hiligaynon-speaking place. Spanish textbooks from centuries ago include Iloilo. --Chris S. 22:09, 28 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I lived on Negros Occidental for a couple years and learned the language pretty well - it seems to me that any difference that could be seen between Hiligaynon and Ilonggo are actually the difference between Ilonggo/Hiligaynon and old deep Ilonggo/Hiligaynon. Anywhere outside a major town/city, the people in the bukid or in other rural places will have many different terms and language shortcuts that don't exist in the city. Speaking of Negros Occidental alone (never went to Panay) that seems to be the case, and that Hiligaynon is the dialect spoken by Ilonggos. That is what I perceived when I interacted with the natives. Law.bradford 21:37, 12 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That is a very astute and correct observation. =) — • Kurt Guirnela • ‡ ^Feedback 03:18, 14 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Tagpila ina nga karne? "How much is this beef?"

I would just like to point out that 'karne' means 'meat' and 'ina' is 'that'.

'Beef' in Ilonggo is 'baka' or 'karne sang baka' as in 'meat of cattle'. 'This' is 'ini'.Si lapu lapu (talk) 21:58, 23 August 2008 (UTC)Si Lapu Lapu[reply]