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Aaron's Reviews > Lonesome Dove
Lonesome Dove
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I was only willing to read this book because a friend told me I had to. When I was thirty pages into it and complaining to him about being unable to handle any more discussion about horses and beans, he made me a bet: If I got to page 101 (out of 900, mind you) and I still didn't enjoy it, he'd take me out to dinner at any restaurant I wanted in New York City. If at page 101 I had warmed up to it, I had to finish. I don't think I made it past the 60th page before I knew I had "lost" the bet.
The characters in this story are more real than in any other book I've read. I came to absolutely love characters I was so thoroughly annoyed with earlier in the book. I feel that the depth of the characters allowed me to do something I can rarely do with the real people I encounter on a daily basis in my life -- to truly know each and every one of them so fully and so deeply so as to be able to wholly sympathize with them and genuinely understand the motivations behind their actions, no matter how much I might disapprove.
I was so engrossed in this book that I had no problem regularly making a fool of myself in public places - on the subway, in coffee shops - gasping, weeping, and shouting "Nuh-uh!"
My only criticism of the book is the way in which it plays into classic Western stereotypes, particularly its portrayal of nearly every Native American character as a brutal savage. Except for one character's brief mention of "well, they didn't invite us on this land," the issues surrounding white settlers effectively stealing the land of another people is not addressed. It's something to try to constantly keep in mind for sure, but not something to keep you from reading this fantastic book.
The characters in this story are more real than in any other book I've read. I came to absolutely love characters I was so thoroughly annoyed with earlier in the book. I feel that the depth of the characters allowed me to do something I can rarely do with the real people I encounter on a daily basis in my life -- to truly know each and every one of them so fully and so deeply so as to be able to wholly sympathize with them and genuinely understand the motivations behind their actions, no matter how much I might disapprove.
I was so engrossed in this book that I had no problem regularly making a fool of myself in public places - on the subway, in coffee shops - gasping, weeping, and shouting "Nuh-uh!"
My only criticism of the book is the way in which it plays into classic Western stereotypes, particularly its portrayal of nearly every Native American character as a brutal savage. Except for one character's brief mention of "well, they didn't invite us on this land," the issues surrounding white settlers effectively stealing the land of another people is not addressed. It's something to try to constantly keep in mind for sure, but not something to keep you from reading this fantastic book.
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Reading Progress
Started Reading
July 1, 2007
–
Finished Reading
July 26, 2007
– Shelved
Comments Showing 1-50 of 52 (52 new)
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Feb 02, 2009 06:14PM
Good review! I also loved the characters especially Gus McRae!!
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I found the Native American stereotypes etc. to be how Gus and Call and the others perceived things. Like, Larry McMurtry is smarter than that and kind of writes with a wink, like, "see what these guys thought?"
What a great review! I also remember shedding some tears on the bus while reading this book, and not even caring!
I too almost put this down but after the "first storm" I'm now hooked!
trying desperately to get my mom to read this book, so I am going to make her read this review...thanks!
I think your review is great. Like you, I devoured this book. I had one issue, though (two now that I read your critique of his use of Indians). Ever notice that they never encounter a railroad?I think I can forgive the Indian thing because of Po Campo and how most of the Mexicans are portrayed.
I think you raise an interesting point in your criticism of the way the book handles or fails to handle the issue of America's policy toward the Native Americans. While I think it's an issue that needs to remain in the American conscience, I don't believe that you can burden every artist with telling that story. Because to simply raise an issue in art isn't sufficient, it then becomes a writer's burden to say something new, to bring a new perspective -otherwise it's simply masturbatory. We have enough writing and film that says: yes we've done terrible things, but we're not bad people because we keep bringing it up. If that's not the story that he wanted to tell, I think it's reasonable that he didn't tell it.
I had the very same thing happen to me. I had a former English teacher of mine recommend it. I was about 50 or so pages in and couldn't imagine going any further, and he said get to page 80. I did. And couldn't put it down. I rarely read a book again, even my favorites. Recently, I picked it back up and started it again. And now, the beginning is delicious.
that's so funny, it took me 100 pages to get into it and then I wished it was 8000 page long!!!!
Nadine wrote: "that's so funny, it took me 100 pages to get into it and then I wished it was 8000 page long!!!!"
I wished it was longer too and he does have some of these characters in other books. However, I almost always get right into his books. The only one that bores me is Duane's Depressed.
I wished it was longer too and he does have some of these characters in other books. However, I almost always get right into his books. The only one that bores me is Duane's Depressed.
Great review! On your point that stealing native land is never addressed, I suppose that the fact that it's never addressed is what addresses it. Not many people back then saw a giant problem with doing horrible things to native americans, and essentially just saw them as savages. So the lack of any comment on it Sort of IS the comment. It highlights the lack of any cares for that particular issue, and how it in many ways was never resolved.
This is the greatest book of all time. The book was absolutely soooooo much better than the movie (which is also my favorite movie)I never wanted either to end. Have not found a more satisfying read since.
Really good book I'm looking for something similar now.
Thanks to your review I picked up this book I had abandoned and once past page 100 or so, was totally hooked that I barely did anything but read, read, read! Best book ever.
It definitely is a good book. Take in Robert Duval in the mini series. Outstanding.
It definitely is a good book. Take in Robert Duval in the mini series. Outstanding.
It definitely is a good book. Take in Robert Duval in the mini series. Outstanding.
It definitely is a good book. Take in Robert Duval in the mini series. Outstanding.
Yes!!! Cried like a baby in some parts of this book!!! It's a slow start for sure but somehow it hooks you in and there is no putting the book down. I don't even like westerns but this ...this my friend was an epic story! The world needs more Gus!
Could you arrange the same bet with your friend for me? I got to page 154 before giving up., I hate it. TO me it is a very badly written book, not in the same league as Cormac McCarthy.
My experience with "Lonesome Dove" was similar to your "bet". I got a copy from my work "Secret Santa" (which means I asked for it) the Christmas season it first came out in paperback. I read 150 pages before I gave up. (I recall saying "What is this shit?") Then I tried again. I got 200 pages in before giving up again. ("Still shit," I recall saying.)
Then I heard there was going to be a mini-series and decided to try a third time. I recall thinking when I got to page 300, "Hmm." When I got to page 400, I thought, "This is pretty good." By the time I got to page 500, I didn't want it to end.
I got to meet McMurtry at a reading of his then-newest book, "Pretty Boy Floyd" (co-written with Diana Osana) and it is one of the great moments of my life when I got to tell him "Not a day goes by that I don't think about 'Lonesome Dove'," especially because it's true.
Further to my previous comment, I did actually persevere and complete the book. It was a great "yarn" but I remain appalled by the lack of skill in the writing. By the time I finished it I was making pencil comments on the pages about some of the things I found most galling, and I have never ever done that before. Mr McMurtry makes the cardinal sin of telling the reader what absolutely everyone is thinking. I thought this was the first rule outlined in creative writing 101, but clearly no one cares anymore. It makes the author obtrusive and godlike. If you think this doesn't matter I will give a good example of why it is bad practice. When Clara moves her husband's bed near the window, it says "but no one knew if he felt the breezes." Well, if the author knows what everyone else is thinking he must know what Bob is thinking too. Further to this are places where the same paragraphs are repeated and another where we are privy to Zwey's thoughts on his three Indian fights and told that "both times he had several men with him." Both means two, not three. These are examples of how badly edited the book is. If I had to re-read it from the start I would cross out unnecessary lines as I read. I reckon I could reduce it by half and make it better for it. For me, even a ripping yarn has to be well written to be judged a good book.
My favourite of all! One day I must acquire the hard cover version to keep on the shelf. I also loved the TV mini series, the best of all time! It's one of those stories where you don't want to finish, you can't bear to say goodbye to the characters.....
Such a good review. I almost out the book down, but now I will do as your friend suggested.
I loved this book. I do not read cowboy or western lit but I love historical fiction. This is an epic story with unforgettable characters.
Enjoyed your review and some of the comments.
I felt the same, although for me it was 200 pages, pretty much part II. In the end I loved it and was glad I didn't give up as normally I would have by then!
This is the review I needed to read. I, too, am put off by the horses and beans. I love a good story, I love long books, but horses and beans are at the very bottom of my list of interests. I'll give this one a real shot.
I am truly disliking it. The writing is horrid and I’m bored stiff.
100 pages. Give it 100 pages.
Hope you don't mind that I included parts of your superb review (with attribution) to put together a kind of composite to further promote this classic.
Eileen wrote: "100 pages. Give it 100 pages."Right! Then after you finish, you go back and read those first 100 and think...ahhhh, so good. There's really no better way to start this.
Totally agree with you about how the characters are like the people we meet everyday.Though I think the white people stealing the land is hinted subtly at many places,if not outright.For example,when Gus points out while he and Call used to hand the horsethives on this side of the border,but they themselves are doing the same crime with Mexicans which suddenly is not a crime for them.I think that's the beauty of this book.No one character is ideal and everyone has their own reason to do what they are doing.Same as life
This book has been on my list for a long time. For those of you that Have read it , do you need to read any of the others in the series before this one?
Exactly my experience with it so far. Reading on my kindle. While at 2% I was thinking what the heck is this? It's supposed to be the best western out there. By 10% I thought, OK not great but at least it makes sense now. I'm now at 20%. Now I'm enjoying it. I finally know that I'll stick it through to the end. I guess you can say it has a "slow burn".
@Kim. No. This was the first book written. I'm reading it first and not confused at all. My misgivings are for other reasons. You'll see when you pick it up to read it yourself.
He does take his time getting them on the trail, but it establishes the characters and that is a good aspect…we can see and care about them as we take the journey to Montana.
Love your review, I’m at 32% and loving it
And you say white settlers stealing land like every race in every time in history didnt steal land and kill or enslave the ocupants
I enjoyed Lonesome Dove right from the git go. I love the characters, and the dialogue in particular. However, I do not share your opinion on McMurtry's characterization of Native Americans. It is apparent that Gus and Woodrow respect the Commanche as formidable fighters. Formidable does not mean bloodthirsty - it means skilled. Gus and Woodrow are also formidable fighters who follow a code.Woodrow even notes that a majority of the Indians in Montana would prefer talking and trading to fighting. He also shares part of the journey to Texas with a group of Indians and their friendly, curious chief.
The most dangerous, bloodthirsty characters in the book are white.
Jon, and your point is….? This is a book about pushing north and west into land previously unsettled by whites. Whether similar things were done in other places at other times doesn’t change what happened. But I also agree with Chris that McMurty portrayed a more nuanced picture of the time than Aaron implies.
I believe it is challenging to portray a balanced view of a wide variety of people and not offend someone. Neither those who came from foreign lands, those who hunted on neighboring lands nor any particular tribe was innocent of violence.
Empire of the Summer Moon is my favorite, deeply researched book on the SW Native American culture.
Hi Aaron,It was by reading your review that I decided to buy this book and give it a try.
I can't thank you enough!
It was such a wonderful adventure - I couldn't put it down.
Thank you for putting me in the path of a truly great read!
Your review is spot on! I started this last night and at page 20 was ready to call it quits. Stopped reading to check reviews as I know this has been referenced everywhere as the great American novel. Read your review and thought I would keep going and once I hit page 70 I was hooked! Thank you for posting a sincere review.
@Jon you are correct, other people have enslaved and stolen land from other people. I don’t get what point you’re making. If I stole your car, would it sting less because “people have been stealing cars long before I was born”?
This is my favorite book and whenever I recommend it I tell people to make sure they just stick it out the first 75 pages
Excellent review, haven't read it yet but your review just made me add it to the top of my list. Thanks!
I totally agree with how well we know these characters by the end. Felt that too. Such a good book.
Great review. Thank you. I will read this.
This is a wonderful review.
