Talk:Sayonara, Zetsubou-Sensei

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According to this dictionary.

You do see the definition "unequalled" as well in other dictionaries such as this or this. In fact, that is the original meaning of the word, etymologically speaking. Nowadays, however, the word is mostly used in the "unequalled in sexual stamina" context. If my words (from the native Japanese speaker) is not enough, Google search of the word yields many websites that use the word in that context. (26 of them among top 30 search results.) Yes, it is technically correct to say 絶倫 means "Unequaled", but saying "Absolutely does not mean horney" is a bit off. Kzaral 19:25, 19 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

You're right, I should have been more specific: It absolutely does not mean horny in this context. There is no implication anywhere in the book that the character is sexually promiscuous. Doceirias 19:58, 19 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

As I said, in modern Japanese, zetsurin mostly means "unequalled in sexual stamina", whatever the context. If you see the manga, when Rin first appears (in vol.2, page 101-), Kafuka calls her "Zetsurin Sensei!" and Rin gets angry (saying "I need a sword now."). She won't get angry if zetsurin means "unequalled" in general context, since it would be a compliment. It's true Rin is not horny character at all, but their names don't always reflect their characters, anyway. Right, most characters in Sayonara Zetsubo Sensei have names related to them. I guess that's why there is a misunderstanding here, but she makes an exception.

Quote from JA Wikipedia article:

名前を繋げて読むと「絶倫」となる事から、可符香に「絶倫先生」と呼ばれる。この為、嫁入りして「糸色」の姓を捨てるのを願望としている。

She wants to abandon the family name "糸色", because she hates the fact it can be read as 絶倫 (Zetsurin), hence the joke. Kzaral 09:03, 6 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

"Kafuka Fūra is not her real name." (From this article.)

I added ^{[citation needed]} template to the above statement. Then User:Juhachi removed it, saying that "that was stated at the end of episode 1." I re-watched the first episode of the anime today, and re-read the first chapter of the book, but was unable to find any reference to that. Can you more precisely locate it, like "17:25 of the anime, episode 1" or "page 11 of the manga, chapter 1"? --Acepectif 19:21, 24 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, it was stated at the end of the afk sub release of episode 1 (after the ending credits are over). I trust that he wasn't making it up and got it from some reliable source, such as the manga in later chapters.--十八 20:02, 24 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Lengthy discussion about it here: http://zetubou.hewl.info/wiki/wiki.cgi?page=%C9%F7%B1%BA%B2%C4%C9%E4%B9%E1 Doceirias 20:10, 24 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Doesn't P.N. stand for "pen name?" (21:58 of ep 1)--Bluish wolf 13:48, 5 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I thought so too. It's visable after her name in the credits of each episode, so that should be evidence enough.--十八 17:56, 5 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I cleaned up some of the second and third episode details. If anyone thinks they are bad or too long, fix them if you want. I just wanted the summerys to be more accurate. JoseSkinner 02:20, 4 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The old one which showed Itoshiki was a much better selection. The current display picture looks very unsuited for the topic. It's just lettering.

I did since the convention used most often is to put the logo in the infobox so it doesn't unnecessarily lengthen the box into the body of the article. Don't blame me if the logo is rather bland.--十八 12:47, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'd prefer to keep it with the manga cover, myself. Problem was, I didn't have a source for that image, and it was about to be deleted. Doceirias 18:41, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

http://www.p-tina.net/interview/14/04.html http://www.p-tina.net/interview/14/01.html Two part interview with the director, probably has some good bits. No time to go through it myself, sorry. Doceirias 20:10, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Did it because there was no mention of her house breaking down. She just can't break her reclusive habit. --68.123.155.254 00:26, 8 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Read the manga. _dk 01:35, 8 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Read it, reread it. Still no signs that her house actually crashed. Her house crumbling is just Fuuka. Unless it's something that's mentioned in later chapters.--68.123.155.254 08:08, 9 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It's in the last chapter of volume 1, from a comment by Kafuka: "Because Komori is here, the school is able to maintain its prosperity. If she leaves the school would be destroyed! Actually, the house Komori-san left a while ago was destroyed. How terrible." (translation mine) _dk 08:30, 9 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I was under the impression that Japanese phones didn't use SMS, but used real Email. Or at the very least, when I was over there for a few weeks, the cheap as hell phone I rented was able to do email to real email addresses.

So why is it that people constantly translate メール to SMS on articles like this?

203.217.22.128 01:53, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Because that's what it means? Cheap messages done from phone to phone. SMS messages can also be sent to ordinary email addresses in Japan or America, but are clearly a stripped down version of the real thing. For longer messages, you would have to use an actual email. Doceirias 03:02, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

That's not exactly the case. Yes, Japan uses SMS to a certain extent in a modified manner. SMS is an intracarrier feature, for example SkyMail on SoftBank. They aren't compatible with other carriers though. You can't send a SkyMail to a DoCoMo phone for instance. So, if the two people happen to be on the same carrier and their message is short enough, then yes they can use their carrier's version of SMS, if not, then it will have to be a real e-mail sent via the internet. Either way, I personally dislike the translation of メール to SMS. 219.25.41.201 (talk) 02:20, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I think the technical distinction is irrelevant to the point of the joke. Few people actually understand the difference, and its more a matter of whether saying you're sending email from your phone sounds natural in English. I don't even really know the term SMS, and would have simply called it messaging - I usually translate it that way. Neutral term, carries across what is happening without needing to be explained. Doceirias (talk) 04:48, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Probably right. I've not read any English translations of manga before, so whether it's actually being translated as "SMS" is something that I do not know. I just hope it's not. "seding a message" or "sending a text" seems much more natural. I would gather most English speakers wouldn't know SMS either or what it is. Conversly, though, instances of messaging via cellphone in from foreign sources (movies, books, etc) get translated to メール in Japanese it seems. So they don't make the distinction either it seems. 219.25.41.201 (talk) 08:42, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have to agree post. SMS is a very specific term for a very specific use, ie a specific protocal. Using SMS for generic messaging system shouldn't be done. 'Text Messaging' which is a more general phrase is more appropriate.Jinnai (talk) 07:38, 16 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The episode summaries are bloated with minutiae, while leaving out helpful context (such as the lack of a mention of the reference to The Metamorphosis in episode 7's title). In other words, they need to be rewritten. I'm going to finish watching the series probably in the next week or so, but anyone else may feel free to work on them in the meantime. Leebo ^T/C 23:03, 5 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

There's a special DVD, titled Sayonara Zetsubō Sensei Jo ~Zetsubō Shōjo Senshū~, from what I've seen in comparison, it looks a lot like recap episode but with several minor changes (such as Ichigo 1000% joke becomes the actual Ichigo 100% manga) and a lot of additional scene. Shouldn't we note this somehow? As OVA? --29dupe (talk) 06:00, 30 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Nevermind that. I've added to the article already, as a special summary DVD. Episode listing is needed, though. --29dupe (talk) 13:34, 2 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

For the first episode of Zoku Sayonara Zetsubo sensei, I've added 当組は問題の多い教室ですから、どうかそこはご承知ください as the title of the first episode as this was the title that appeared immediately after the opening theme song. Meanwhile, the sub-part before the opening theme seemed more like a complementary part to the episode 1. Do you think we should put both of the titles for episode 1 in the episode list like this ほら、男爵の妄言／当組は問題の多い教室ですから どうかそこはご承知ください? Or just the title of the main episode of the episode 1 like it is right now. Stevefis (talk) 21:45, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I've been wondering why we've only had one title each since it seems that every episode has two. Shouldn't both be included?—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 22:08, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that this should be included but if we do this, I think we should have done the same to first season too. Also, all episode title is a parody to something, shouldn't we note this too? --29dupe (talk) 22:20, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

For now, maybe we can use the two title format for each episodes in the second season and also convert the titles in the first season one by one to the two title format.Stevefis (talk) 22:40, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

For formatting, I think if we do something like this mockup, it should be much easier to read. But I don't know if it's possible to request editing for Template:Japanese episode list for something trivial like this. --29dupe (talk) 23:25, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That definitely looks better; given the number of shows (particularly gag anime) that have this two short episodes equal one episode format, it might be worth either adding to the template, or creating an alternate template that allowed the two titles for each episode. Doceirias (talk) 23:38, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

As with User:TangentCube said below, I guess making a new template for this purpose seems to be a better way. Something like Template:Japanese episode list-compatible multi-line template swappable only when needed. Now for me to learn how to write template... —29th ((☎)) 02:20, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The episode template has had problems running into the transclusion size limit in the past with the longer lists (One Piece et al.), so the last thing we need is to increase its size; what do you think of the example at Nagasarete Airantō? —TangentCube, Dialogues 23:36, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That looks nice too, although I prefer two-rows style as it's much easier to scan through the article. But if increasing the template's size will cause problem to long list, then I guess we'll have to use this "<br />" for now. —29th ((☎)) 02:20, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

How does this look for a template? —TangentCube, Dialogues 03:53, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Looks great! I think we can use that without any problems. —29th ((☎)) 04:59, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Created as Template:Japanese episode list multi-part. —TangentCube, Dialogues 06:19, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Now we just gotta get the titles for season one. Eheh.—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 07:05, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I did a quick scan of the first season and only found three episodes with two titles:

• Episode 4, B part: アンテナ立ちぬいざ生きめやも
• Episode 7, A part: 仮名の告白
• Episode 10, A part: 一人の文化人が羅生門の下で雨やどりしていた

I may have read some of those wrong, too. —TangentCube, Dialogues 09:36, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Added. —29th ((☎)) 21:06, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The episode summary for Zoku's first episode seems to suggest that it's not really a "second season" so much as a "reimagining" (e.g., the original Negima!: Magister Negi Magi vs. Negima!?). Should we be calling it "second season"? "Second series" is probably a better description – in any case, we should at least say "Zoku" instead of constantly saying "second season."—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 01:51, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

A-Part of the first episode is a "fake summary" joke from sleeve-cover of manga Vol.1. They (kind of) disregard this part by putting it as avant title (before the OP, although I take 8 minutes) and saying "From sleeve-cover of Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei volume. 1". B-Part is just the same Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei as previous season. —29th ((☎)) 02:13, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Oh. So it's one of those confusing episodes where it's kind of difficult to tell whether it's imaginary or not?—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 02:17, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It's more like those spin-off extra OVA that has nothing related to the main story (like Magical Girl Kokoro-chan for School Days). I've changed the article to reflect this already. —29th ((☎)) 21:08, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

More of a dadaist stunt, like the cliffhanger ending that was utterly ignored the next week, or Kafka's real name. (Someone actually calls her An-chan in the first episode of the new season.) Expecting narrative coherence from this series is a fool's errand anyway... Doceirias (talk) 22:44, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This episode is supposedly based on one of the manga chapter, but the japanese subtitle of script has been so heavily distorted that the whole chapter doesn't make much sense. Should we put the content of original manga chapter or the japanese subtitle that is provided by the anime episode?Stevefis (talk) 16:56, 13 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well, of course we're going to use the anime's episode subtitle. If it's the anime's name for the episode, it's what goes into the anime episode list.—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 18:54, 13 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'd like to follow the anime's episode subtitle, but it's really full of jibberish (looks like some kind of prank) and nonsenses, which cannot be really put into a sensible summary. The manga's script fits nearly perfectly with the animation and its content makes much more sense. If I have to make a summary out of the anime's subtitle, it would be "An alien invades Nozumu's school and messes up everything".. For now, I'll put manga's summary and make note of it. Stevefis (talk) 19:19, 13 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

After reading a translation; seems like the subtitle itself is a parody to Dragon Ball Z and doesn't really make any sense. But anyway, those short summary were to represent the anime episode, anime version of the subtitle should be use in this case. However, I think the original story from the manga, which makes much more sense, should be noted somewhere in the article. —29th ((☎)) 05:44, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I recognize that it may well have been an intentional word play on the part of the manga/anime creators, but just to be sure, is the sequel really entitled using the character 俗 (zoku), meaning vulgar, i.e. not refined, not classy, rather than the more common 続 (zoku), meaning a continuation? LordAmeth (talk) 09:19, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The easiest way to check it to watch the anime or visit the official website. http://www.starchild.co.jp/special/zetsubou2/ Stevefis (talk) 11:28, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Righto. Sorry for the bother. LordAmeth (talk) 21:55, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]