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On my own user page I have provided what I believe is ample evidence against the absurd claim of this article that Persian was the official, administrative, or literary language of the Ottoman Empire at any point in its history. Literary Ottoman Turkish was heavily influenced by Persian, it is true, but that does not make it the same thing as Persian, just as the profuse borrowings from Latin and French does not make English a Romance language. I will not bother to argue about removing the Ottomans from this page altogether as I think the whole concept of 'Persianate societies' is absurd, but if you want so badly to have it, then fine, but try at least not to have any glaringly obvious historical errors in it. I want to remove the statement 'At the end of the 17th century, they gave up Persian as the court and administrative language, using Turkish instead; a decision that shocked the highly Persianized Mughals in India', but the user Kansas Bear keeps restoring it. As I said, see my user talk page for references to the contrary.

128.232.251.99 (talk) 20:44, 29 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

"A Persianate society, or Persified society, is a society that is based on or strongly influenced by the Persian language, culture, literature, art and/or identity."

Sources for the Ottomans usage of Persian, both in bureacratic, literature(historical), poetry, etc.

• "Ironically while Persian had become the Ottoman court language...." -- The Western Christian Presence in the Russias and Qājār Persia, c.1760–c.1870, by Thomas O Flynn, page 30.

• "The use of Persian as the language of high culture linked the various imperial courts of the Muslim lands, Ottoman, Safavi..." -- The Arabs of the Ottoman Empire, 1516–1918: A Social and Cultural History, by Bruce Masters, page 107. --Kansas Bear (talk) 19:47, 29 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• M. Sukru Hanioglu, A Brief History of the Late Ottoman Empire, page 35, "In a way, Ottoman resembled Latin as used in medieval or early modern Europe. It supplanted Persian, which had served as the literary language of the cultured upper classes during the first three centuries of the empire."
• Culture and Learning in Islam, edited by Ekmeleddin İhsanoğlu, page 54, "In later periods, Persian was in current use in the Ottoman Empire amongst men-of-letters and in courts."
• Turko-Persian in Historical Perspective, by Robert L. Canfield, page 19;"The empires that arose in the sixteenth century were the Ottomans in Asia Minor, the Safavids in Iran..[..] Unlike Iran they gradually shed some of their Persianate qualities: they were the first of the gunpowder empires to give up Persian as the court language, using instead Turkish..." --Kansas Bear (talk) 03:39, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

And your quote from Cambridge History of Turkey is take from this chapter:The literature of Rum: The making of a literary tradition (1450–1600), which oddly you have seemed to miss:

• "Arabic was established early in the Muslim courts of Rum as the language of sciences, and Persian was defined as the language of literature; both were employed for bureaucratic purposes. Until the earlier decades of the fifteenth century, the Rum elite were ambivalent about employing Turkish in their works....", page 558.
• "However paradoxical it may seem, the development of a high literary version of written Turkish by the bureaucrats along with the reformation of education institutions entailed the advancement of learning in Arabic and Persian during the reigns of Murad II and, especially, his son Mehmed II.", page 558. --Kansas Bear (talk) 05:25, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Cambridge History of Turkey, Vol. 2, page 434, "Ottoman visions of social order and politics draw heavily on the Persianate tradition of manuals of statecraft.". --Kansas Bear (talk) 05:39, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Please note that every edit made by the IP has removed references and referenced information:

• [1]
• [2]
• [3]
  

Along with a personal attack, " If you are going to be chauvinistic at least use proper sources.". In response, I have quoted the Cambridge History of Turkey, Vol 2, seven times, which prove that Persian was used by the Ottomans in their bureaucracy, personal learning, and statecraft.
I have yet to see anything that refutes the references currently in the article. --Kansas Bear (talk) 05:58, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

More:

• Cambridge History of Turkey, Vol. 2, page 435;"..and specifically Ottoman, understanding of social order and government, with Kinalizade Ali's Ahlak-i Alai as its most important representative. Once again, this literature builds on Persianate models..."
• Cambridge History of Turkey, Vol. 2, page 488;"Interest in illustrated manuscripts of Persian literary works continued into the reign of Bayezid II..[...]..where Persianate iconography and visual norms representational choices specific to the Ottoman court were often deployed together."
• Cambridge History of Turkey, Vol. 2, page 491;"The words Sukri-i Bidlisi put into Selim's mouth highlight the acutal and perceived dominance of Persianate cultural forms in the Ottoman courtly milieu of these decades..."
• Cambridge History of Turkey, Vol. 2, 498;"Thus the manuscript attests to the enthusiastic embrace of the books arts of the Persianate world on the part of Ottoman designers and audiences who over the decades maintained a dialogue with this tradition." --Kansas Bear (talk) 07:14, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You are deflecting the real issue here. The sentence in question in this article is not about the influence or usage of Persian language in Ottoman arts, it is the use of Persian as the official court language. You are quoting many sources, none of which confirm your case that Persian was the official court language of the Ottoman Empire 'until the 17th century'.