Talk:Death Busters: Difference between revisions

Template:WikiProject Sailor Moon

Anime and manga Start‑class Low‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Anime and manga, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of anime, manga, and related topics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Anime and mangaWikipedia:WikiProject Anime and mangaTemplate:WikiProject Anime and mangaanime and manga articles Start This article has been rated as Start-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Archives: 01

This gets reverted by well-meaning passersby often enough that we should find a source for it ASAP. --Masamage 01:58, 4 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Kaori Knight was shown on the box for the Irwin Toys release of the dolls (back in 1996). We know now that this was incorrect spelling, as the SMS dub series was not starting production for another 4 years. On the back of the Pioneer release of the edited version of SMS (Vol.3 "Birthday Blues"), her name is shown as KAORINITE, as it is also shown in the subtitled version of the DVDs released by Pioneer which seems to use all the dub spellings of the names (which are pretty much just an alteration of the Romanized original Japaneses names). Fighter4luv 13:35, 20 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent! Thank you so much. I'll change it to that effect now. --Masamage 04:22, 22 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Also, there is no proof of Kirsten Bishop ever voicing Telulu. We are only aware of her doing the voices for Zoycite, Emerald, Kaorinite, and Badiyanu (btw, she wasn't referred to as "Queen Badiyanu" in the English version). We are still unaware of the voice actress who did Telulu, but it doesn't sound like anyone who has worked on the English Sailor Moon version previously. Fighter4luv 07:15, 28 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I remember her being Badiyanu in English. o_O I'll remove Ms. Bishop from Tellu's bio, anyway. Thanks. --Masamage 20:24, 28 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, the "" were only supposed to be around the "Queen" part, lol. She was referred to as Badiyanu, just not Queen Badiyanu. Fighter4luv 12:36, 29 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Ohhhh! Gotcha. I'll make it happen. :) --Masamage 22:28, 29 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

We either A: Need a Section along with an image or B: Talk more about him under the Prof's Section and supply a pic. --Lego3400: The Sage of Time 16:26, 29 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Do you mean Germatoid? Because there is a pic already. He's the possessed form, isn't he? --Masamage 19:11, 29 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah him... But doesn't he leave the professor in order to attack the senshi? Lego3400: The Sage of Time 01:53, 1 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

He does leave the Professor's body and attacks Uranus and Neptune. It was the first uses of "Submarine Reflection" and "Space Sword Blaster" in the anime, although they didn't use the phrases. -SaturnYoshi ^{THE VOICES} 15:46, 7 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

i hope no one minds but i deleted one of the mistress 9 pictures because evrey other death buster had one picture and i didnt see why it need two but if any one has a problem im sorry Sailor cuteness 23:10, 8 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That's fine. The other one is used for the Holy Grail section of the talismans, anyway. -SaturnYoshi ^{THE VOICES} 00:05, 9 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm, I think it looks better now. ^^ Thanks! --Masamage 21:28, 11 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Speaking of Mistress 9, this info on her is incomplete:

"In anime Mistress 9's voice is played by Yuko Minaguchi."

What's wrong with that? No English actress. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ggctuk (talk • contribs) 08:53, 27 March 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Do you who it is? 'Cause we don't. --Masamage 17:44, 27 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It sounds like Black Ladys dub voice actress to me ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 15:55, 28 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I would have thought it was the same as Hotaru Tomoe's voice actress, Jennifer Gould (Hope I got that right) 213.166.17.12 09:54, 2 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

no SMU goes into why there diffrent people doing the Voice acting ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 09:45, 21 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Took out this:

As opposed to the anime, which implies that she has always been a supernatural being

First, I don't see how the anime implies anything about her origins, and second, what's "supernatural" about her? - Sikon 13:14, 24 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. All your edits were very helpful; thanks! :) --Masamage ♫ 15:20, 24 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Mistress 9 and Karoinite had only head shots so I uploaded new images for them... I'm thinking of reuploading the mistress 9 one so you can see a close up of the star on her forehead but i Wanna check with you guys before this Lego3400: The Sage of Time 02:01, 21 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Those look better, thanks. I think we probably don't need the closeup one, just because we already have a shot of the symbol itself... --Masamage ♫ 04:27, 21 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No problem.. The only thing is that i wish i could have found Kaolinite in her Black outfit... There was this really nice one but her eyes were closed so i didn't use it.Lego3400: The Sage of Time 15:25, 21 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think it's good. The red sets her off from looking just like Mistress 9. :) --Masamage ♫ 15:59, 21 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

In the english manga Pharoh 90 wanted to murge with Earth and move it to the Tau Ceti Star System is this true in the orignal version if so we should add it t the page ♥Fighting for charming Love♥ 19:15, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Its quite confusing on who is really the Messiah of Silence. Is it really Mistress 9? Or Sailor Saturn? Or Pharaoh 90? I think its Pharaoh 90 since neither Saturn nor Mistress 9 obtained the power of the holy grail... Remember that the rightful messiah can use the grail's infinite power. The grail was utilized by Pharaoh 90 to gain entrance to the world.Mines32 (talk) 16:40, 19 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This article needs a heck of a lot of cleanup, but I've always been confused about that myself. I have no idea which of those three it really is. --Masamage ♫ 16:53, 19 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Same here.Mines32 (talk) 16:56, 19 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have proposed merging the Witches 5 article into this one. If we trimmed out all the excessive plot info from both, they would both be fairly short and heavily dependent on each other, and so would be much better together. For the time being it would be sort of a subsidiary character list--once the full list is up and running we can reevaluate this. --Masamage ♫ 21:07, 11 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It's been over a week with no responses, particularly no objections. If we go one more week and no one minds, I'll proceed with the merge. --Masamage ♫ 16:38, 19 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I proceed to object - the merging will not just 'trim' the information on the Witches5, it will leave it bare and sparse. There's plenty of information for this sub-group of villains, and should be left alone. Saintvlas22 (talk) 17:40, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Let me explain myself more clearly. According to Wikipedia policies (WP:PLOT, WP:WAF, etc.), character pages like this one are the wrong place for storyline information. There is a correct place, and that's List of Sailor Moon S episodes and List of Sailor Moon chapters (both still in progress).

Now, as it happens, the Death Busters page itself is in much worse shape than the Witches 5 page. Every character's section needs to be cleaned out, down to three or four paragraphs. In the case of, say, Kaolinite, this will be pretty drastic. But in the case of the Witches, those are already only a few paragraphs long, and probably won't require very much trimming to make them fit in nicely here. Nothing will be lost except poor phrasing and organization. Hopefully a little out-of-universe info will be added.

The major thing this merge will do is hugely improve organization. It'll include all the necessary information to understand what's going on with this villain group, but all in the same place and (hopefully) in more precise language. Right now, both articles have to refer to each other constantly, and it's very confusing if you don't know the series already. So don't worry about losing important stuff; these things just need better locations. --Masamage ♫ 17:48, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

And here is yet another case of roundabout logic that only makes sense to the select who are oh so very enlightened. I guess it was a stretch for me to try to say otherwise - I don't understand why you asked for objections if you're just gonna do the merge anyways. Why can't Kaolinite just get a page of her own by the way? Clearing out her already smooshed and crammed article on the Deathbusters page will make her fade away; for fans who don't know much about the season/series, it will seem that she isn't a character that is important. Every other subgroup of villains from each of the seasons has a page for them (Shittenou, Ayakashi Sisters, etc.) and I thought that this page, though in need of a cleaning, was a good idea overall. This 'organization' is the deleting of every little thing that isn't notable, or doesn't meets this policy or that policy, doesn't have fair use, has no real world criteria, blah blah blah etc. It isn't an improvement having everything crammed together with no reference or detail being included; might as well just watch the damn series yourself since you can't get any information here what with all the merging and deleting. It's quite organized and tidy - when there's NOTHING there isn't it? Saintvlas22 (talk) 18:32, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You are clearly coming to this discussion with a lot of anger about other situations, other discussions, and other merges. You raised a concern, and I tried to resolve it. That's what discussion is all about. If you're going to rant and rave and swear at me, we won't get anything done.

As I said, this merge will not result in "deleting everything". I like the series and these characters, and have no interest in demolishing their presence on Wikipedia. Everything "crammed together with no reference or detail" is your own fear talking; it's not what I've proposed to happen here. This will be a tidy organization with plenty of reference and plenty of detail. It will also comply with all Wikipedia's policies. We can have it both ways, and that's exactly the plan. If we leave it the way it is, eventually someone who doesn't like the series will come along to enforce policy, and they won't be interested in including details. Much better to do it ourselves.

For more of a perspective: Kaolinite did used to have her own article, and it was terrible. By consensus, it was merged in. In fact, each of the Witches 5 used to have her own withered little page, but we've found by experience that they work much better together. Combining with the Death Busters will be better yet. --Masamage ♫ 19:07, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting how you talk about my own assumptions and fears when you so righteously accuse me of having prior anger and that I commonly don't get my way in other discussions. I guess that kind of turn-around logic gets you quite far when modifying articles and chopping things to pieces on Wikipedia. I continue to state that you're simply trimming down articles (specifically Sailor Moon articles) because that IS what you're doing. The previous Kaolinite article - you say it was deleted because it was awful. I see no sense in having it merged when it could have been simply improved. That character's entry in the Deathbuster's article is messy, vague and leaves you wondering why she is even included, hence people not understanding her character's role in the series. I also said that I liked the idea of the Witches 5 article; to clarify, I meant the collective article where all 5 are included as there wasn't enough information for just single-episode appearing villains. That article needed work, but it fit in with all the other subgroup villains. Just because you can't see the potential of the Witches 5 article, doesn't mean it can't simply be redone - no need to delete it and cram it into the main article and make it a mess, like the Kaolinite article.

I get that you like the series, but I fail to see any logic in your way of doing things - if it doesn't work out, get rid of more and more of it so it becomes 'workable'. Your assurance that you intend to keep quality information (the little that will probably remain after you are done with it) is sorely laughable. And it is not an actual discussion when you have no intention of being swayed and that you aren't open to just leaving the damn article. Saintvlas22 (talk) 19:29, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

P.S: Oh, I'm sorry - I guess one 'swear' word equals an angry rant and tirade against your person. Next time I shall keep it less than G-rated, whatever that is... Really, stop taking things out of proportion - both with your interactions with me, and when it comes to articles.

I'm not sure what I did to deserve your hostility, but obviously we need more people involved here. I'll drop a line at the anime Wikiproject. --Masamage ♫ 20:32, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well, as I am sure most of the people involved in sanctioned communities will stick together and go by the nonsense logic that is most Wikipedia policies, I don't see any point in further debate or 'discussion'. To me, it's going to be only a matter of time until it's merged/hacked/deleted, so I don't see any point in furthering this - it insults both of us to prolong any pretense of both parties engaging in any sort of mutual interest. I expect to be doused with mentionings of senseless policies, and logic that most people are unable to crack as being anything but hypocritical and self-serving. Do whatever you want, whatever you think 'benefits' and leave me out of the upcoming consensus of parroting, hypocritical yes men who drone alike in the same trains of thought. I'm sure most people will prefer personal wikis, fan sites and Sailor Moon interest websites over the dead plain that will become this particular article. Why? Because it will actually have some substance, and not try to masquerade as anything but an article written by fans about an anime series - it isn't a freaking piece of literary art. Oh, it's also quite demeaning the way you play victim, and distance yourself from anything I have actually said. Cheers, and good riddance. Saintvlas22 (talk) 20:46, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Merge per the anime and manga MoS, WP:N, WP:WAF, and WP:PLOT. The Witches 5 are a part of the Death Busters and really there is no need to keep them separate. Additionally, they are not notable on their own, having no significant coverage in reliable sources. Indeed, I suspect the Death Busters as a whole fails the same standard, but would propose doing the merge then work on building this single article up to a higher standard. If it can't be done, then revisited the idea merging this into a central List of Sailor Moon characters (along with several of the other non-notable breakouts). And Saintvlas22, whether you like it or not this IS Wikipedia, it does have standards and policies. If you want the full blown fan-oriented, plot filled stuff, you are correct, there are personal websites and SM wikis happy to cater to those desires. This, however, is not any of those. It is an encyclopedia with higher standards. -- Collectonian (talk · contribs) 21:02, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It's an online encyclopedia that seemingly anyone can edit - false advertising at it's worse by the way, as editors such as yourself deem yourself above everyone else by dictating what we can, and cannot edit. It should be 'Wikipedia: the encyclopedia anyone can edit so as as we say so'. As I expected, there isn't room for 'discussion' - it was a done deal whether anyone said anything or not - thank you for proving me correct. Maybe now you'll stop pretending like anyone else's opinion or any form of consensus actually exists? Saintvlas22 (talk) 21:57, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

If it'll get you to go away. You've been acting like a jerk this whole debate, and there's no reason to believe you would put your differences aside and contribute constructively before haranguing everyone else about your silly little point. So, yeah, sure, we all are conspiring against you, so could you go? JuJube (talk) 22:14, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I don't believe you're conspiring against me at all - if you think I actually think enough of Wikipedia editing that I actually believe random people on the internet exist solely for the reason of being somewhat minor annoyances - then you're an idiot. I merely stated what is going on - that there is no consensus, and that asking for an opinion when you want none is insulting and frivolous. They asked if there were any objections to the merge - they already proved that they were going to do it anyways regardless, so it isn't my fault they can't deal with being called out on it. My contribution would have been to redo the Witches 5 article - since their royal Wikipedia highness' have decreed in their own heads and through idiocy of the Wikipedia policies that it will no longer exist, I can say that I'm frustrated, since their reasoning is faulty and their explanation lacking much fairness or common sense, at least to normal people. My 'silly little point' is that no, it isn't fair, it's ridiculous, and it's not my fault they can't see anyone else's point but theirs. I have as much a right to edit and contribute as they do, yet it's a member's only club apparently since they won't do much to accommodate others' ideas or opinions. So sorry if I'm not all sunshine and daisy's when addressing them - idiots deserve to be spoken to like idiots if that's how they want to act willingly. 24.83.177.183 (talk) 00:00, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That's not Wikipedia's policy, although right now I kinda wish it was since it's clear I'm talking to a massive idiot here. JuJube (talk) 00:11, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I fail to see how applying wikipedia's policies (which were formed through long debates over the course years) would in anyway exclude the average person from editing. However, you dont get to pick and choose which policies to follow and which to ignore. All articles need to cover a given topic from a real-world context with reliable third-party sources; and when article are merged, it become much easier to do this, and thus much easier for the average reader. --Kraftlos (talk) 00:24, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well then, if I am a MASSIVE idiot, does that mean that I can at least join the club now? I'm sure I'd be very comfortable with the idiots like you. Honestly, do you even know what I was talking about? Come off it, don't entertain the thought that I'm simply a troll or whatever, and you are the righteous editor come to put me in my place. I was trying to make own voice heard, and another lemming like yourself isn't going to make me leave. Wikipedia isn't all picturesque and well oiled, and I was merely making it known that whatever policy or standard or personal behest is thrown out there in this regard, it's still idiotic and counter-productive, not including senseless as I have emphasized. It shouldn't be merged- nor should the Deathbusters article be merged. It's pathetic that that they would still do it after making a half assed attempt to justify it - leading me to read convoluted logic found in all those loopy policies is bullshit, because it does an even worse job of explaining their logic than they do. If they can't explain why it is that Witches 5 has to be merged, except to themselves, than the point is that they satisfy only their needs and have no right to take over without having made a valid point. Saintvlas22 (talk) 00:27, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]