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Requested move 20 January 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved per WP:SNOW (non-admin closure) (t · c) buidhe 19:35, 20 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]


Turkey → Türkiye – The country has changed its English name to Türkiye. 2600:6C5A:657F:D1F5:48D3:2853:9745:8762 (talk) 03:20, 20 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Won't happen as everyone will keep referring to them as Turkey! Vif12vf/Tiberius (talk) 03:27, 20 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

RfC on the official name of the country in the lede

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: There's consensus for Option 1. Among the cited arguments is that the country's name has not been officially changed at the UN. (non-admin closure) (t · c) buidhe 17:04, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]



Which of the following two should be the article's lede sentence?

  1. Turkey (Turkish: Türkiye [ˈtyɾcije]), officially the Republic of Turkey (Turkish: Türkiye Cumhuriyeti [ˈtyɾcije dʒumˈhuːɾijeti] ⓘ)
  2. Turkey (Turkish: Türkiye [ˈtyɾcije]), officially the Republic of Türkiye (Turkish: Türkiye Cumhuriyeti [ˈtyɾcije dʒumˈhuːɾijeti] ⓘ)

Chess (talk) (please use {{reply to|Chess}} on reply) 19:38, 9 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Poll

  • Option 2. The most official name in English is "Türkiye", not "Turkey". WP:COMMONNAME doesn't apply here because we're discussing what we should describe the official name as, not what we should title or describe the country as in the text. Chess (talk) (please use {{reply to|Chess}} on reply) 19:38, 9 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 1 We do not base wikipedia articles off the statements of Turkish state media. The UN still lists Turkey's name as "Turkey" and it is still WP:COMMONNAME so I suggest Option 1 unless there is some sort of official law mandating the change.
    There is still no official act of the Grand National Assembly mandating this name change. Erdoğan can flaunt his nationalist agenda all he wants, but I am only willing to change my answer if there is a specific law for changing the name. CollectiveSolidarity (talk) 19:37, 12 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 2 The Turkish government is using the name "Republic of Türkiye" and the article should be in line with other articles such as the Ivory Coast with "Republic of Côte d'Ivoire" even if is not the common English name of the country.--Kappasi (talk) 17:47, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 2 for neutrality, so that both spellings of the name (Turkey, Türkiye) are represented. Khestwol (talk) 17:51, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 1 It’s misleading to say this is a new “official” name. What has happened is much more limited than that. This is Erdogan’s circular of 3 December and this is Hürriyet Daily News’s coverage of it. What the circular actually says is that “Made in Türkiye” should be stamped on exports - that’s the focus of the circular. As far as other usage is concerned, it says “necessary sensitivity will be shown on the use of the phrase ‘Türkiye’ instead of phrases such as ‘Turkey,’ ‘Turkei,’ ‘Turquie’ etc.”. Erdogan doesn’t under the constitution have the power to determine an “official name” for the country and the circular doesn’t claim that this is the official name in English. Some of the Turkish media have got very excited about this and there’s plenty of exaggerated references to an “official name” but I don’t believe any such media coverage is WP:RS for the legal position, which is this is about, per WP:RSCONTEXT. DeCausa (talk) 18:12, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Türkiye is used by most government departments now on their official English language websites, not just for products made in Turkey.Kappasi (talk) Kappasi (talk) 20:44, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    that doesn’t make it the “official name” and there are departments that don’t use it. DeCausa (talk) 20:51, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 1 The official name of the country has not changed. It is still Türkiye Cumhuriyeti. We translate it by its components the way these are translated in common usage: Türkiye → "Turkey" Cumhuriyet → "Republic". The current government has chosen to promote "Turkiye" as translation for Türkiye, and hence "Republic of Türkiye" for Türkiye Cumhuriyeti, but that does not affect the rendering of the official name in WP based on common usage. –Austronesier (talk) 18:30, 10 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 1. As far as I can tell, Erdogan did not declare "Republic of Türkiye" to be the country's official name. His memo expressed his wish that "Türkiye" be used as the brand of the nation in official publications and communications, mentioning "Made in Türkiye" in particular. No mention of what the official name in English should be. Many sources covering this in the following months have made it clear that this is an ongoing process, including by getting the UN to change the way it refers to the country. No source presented so far has said that this has actually happened. The UN is still using "Republic of Turkey".
    Major Turkish governmental institutions, including its national legislature and highest court, are still prominently using "Turkey", with the Constitutional Court using the full "Republic of Turkey". English language news media is continuing to use "Republic of Turkey" over "of "Türkiye" by about 5:1, according to Google News hits over the past month. Even Turkey's executive branch does not seem to have settled on its final choice. As of February, Erdogan was considering dropping the diacritic mark from the u.
    Nothing official has happened when it comes to "Republic of Türkiye" yet. We'll know when it's official because the whole Turkish government, other nations, intergovernmental organizations, and news media will shift. That has not happened. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 04:01, 11 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 1 for now. As I read from some sources (here, here and here, for instance), Turkey is registering the new name at the UN. I would switch to Option 2 when this registration will become official. P1221 (talk) 07:24, 11 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Why would “registering” the name at the UN make a difference? The UN doesn’t have a function as an “official name” registry. Might as well check the registration at the International Poultry Council. DeCausa (talk) 12:49, 11 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The UN does have this function actually, assigned to UNGEGN. Even without this, a submission to any international body, in general, would be a useful sign that the name change was serious. In line with that, I note that the International Poultry Council still refers to the country as "Turkey". CMD (talk) 13:20, 11 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
They may well be the last hold out for the old name…UNGEGN is an “experts forum” for cartographic consistency, as I understand it. I don’t think a country can “register” their preferences with them. Basically, what Turkey has done has put in their request for what goes on the name plaque that they sit behind. DeCausa (talk) 13:31, 11 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Some of NATO and Organisation of Turkic States seems to use this. Beshogur (talk) 13:10, 14 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Türkiye is already mentioned, and is the third word of the first sentence, in the article currently, and in both options. The issue isn’t about mentioning it, it’s whether, in addition to that, it should also be stated the “official name” is “Republic of Türkiye”. DeCausa (talk) 18:30, 12 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yes "Türkiye Cumhuriyeti" Moxy- 20:45, 12 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Turkey ..., officially the Republic of Turkey or Türkiye ... not sure for infobox. Maybe Republic of Turkey / Türkiye. Beshogur (talk) 13:09, 14 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 1 Per other users, this dictat was not a constitutional change nor a law, and seems to only apply to official organizations. Not only that, it doesn't seem to catch on outside of Turkish governmental media outlets, which seem to be obliged to follow this decree. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ido66667 (talk • contribs) 20:53, 14 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 2 The Official name is Republic of Türkiye so we should use it.Yousef Raz (talk) 22:59, 14 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Option 1 Until such time as it is clear that international bodies - such as the UN - have adopted this form. Pincrete (talk) 15:05, 15 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Has been done...just waiting on UN [4] Moxy- 21:21, 18 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, that source doesn’t say it has been done. In fact, all the sources to date seem to say that Turkey is planning to do it with no confirmation that it has been done yet, eg this which said back in January that it was going to be done “in the coming weeks”. DeCausa (talk) 22:01, 18 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
yup done all over just not at the UN yet.....Why are we waiting on the UN...is it the only source we can use? What is wrong with the constitution? Seem odd for us to wait on one single source when we have many that are much more relevent. Moxy- 22:09, 18 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It’s not in the constitution and no one’s using it much. DeCausa (talk) 22:18, 18 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't knew that Turkey's Turkish constitution talked about English name of its name. I don't think so. Also Organization of Turkic States and some NATO bodies started to use the name "Türkiye". Beshogur (talk) 14:59, 19 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Exactly. DeCausa (talk) 15:15, 19 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Other proposal

I think there’s an Option 3 to reflect that Erdoğan has launched a campaign to have Türkiye adopted in foreign language use even if it isn’t actually an “official name” change. I suggest adding a footnote to the words “…officially the Republic of Turkey…” in the first sentence which says:

Footnote
Beginning with a presidential circular issued in December 2021, President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan launched a campaign, latterly called Say Türkiye, to have the Turkish word for the country, Türkiye, used in all languages instead of foreign language equivalents.[1] As a result, the Turkish Foreign Ministry and some other state agencies have begun using the phrase Republic of Türkiye on the English language versions of their respective websites.[2]

References

  1. ^ "'Say Türkiye' campaign to promote changing country's int'l name starts". Hürriyet Daily News. 17 February 2022. Retrieved 15 April 2022.
  2. ^ Soylu, Ragip (17 January 2022). "Turkey to register its new name Türkiye to UN in coming weeks". Middle East Eye. Retrieved 11 April 2022.

This, I think, more accurately reflects that this is about a campaign to encourage a change of usage rather than an “official” name change, which overstates what’s happening. DeCausa (talk) 12:44, 15 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That's unnecessary and UNDUE, IMHO. Turkey#Name is a more fitting place for that, not a footnote in the lead. Some1 (talk) 01:53, 23 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Lead sentence - mention Türkiye as official name

Given all the hubbub around the official name change, I would like to propose a mention of the official name being "Türkiye" in the lead, in a somewhat similar fashion to Ivory Coast / Côte d'Ivoire:

Turkey, officially Türkiye (Turkish: [ˈtyɾcije]) and in long form the Republic of Türkiye (Turkish: Türkiye Cumhuriyeti [ˈtyɾcije dʒumˈhuːɾijeti] ⓘ)

Appreciate any good faith feedback, especially in terms of wording and ensuring good prose. MSG17 (talk) 11:53, 4 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It is "UN official short name". ISO says Turkey. UK recognizes Turkey as official short name. USA - CIA says it's Turkey. Britannica - Turkey... etc. Which source has a privilege to declare "official" names in English language? Check UNGEGN and you will see dozens of differences between Wikipedia and UN what is considered official name (short and long). Chrz (talk) 12:07, 4 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I don't mean to say official as in "the official name decided by a language regulator/external authority", but official as in "officially sanctioned by the Turkish government". Of course, Turkey is still by and far the common name. MSG17 (talk) 12:41, 4 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, and I say: In the sentence "Turkey, officially Türkiye", according to who is it official? And is there only one main authority which decides offficial ENGLISH name? Turkish government is able to create official Turkish short name and official Turkish political name. UN lists official names for its intentions and purposes but is it "the official" name to be in the lead? Is there only one official short name in English for this country and who announces it? Also, editors here do not differentiate between official and formal. They think that there's some kind of common (usually very short) name, which is totally unofficial, and then the official name meaning political name for diplomacy. UN and ISO lists up to 2 names for each country and both of them are official, so...
Also, "official English name" and "English translation of official name in foreign language" are generally 2 different things and we are looking for the first one. Chrz (talk) 12:51, 4 June 2022 (UTC) Chrz (talk) 13:09, 4 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
There is no such thing as an "official English name" in the sense you mean. For the simple reason that there is no controlling body for the English language. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 16:23, 9 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
So WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY does every single article does have "officially" in LEDE? Wikipedia-officially I gues >:( Chrz (talk) 17:44, 9 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
No, that is "official" as in "what the country calls itself in English". --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 20:10, 9 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
UN official names: Short name, Formal name
ISO official names: Short name, Full name
Yet another typical terminology: Geographical name, Political name
What country calls itself in English: typically 2 names, short and long
Wiki terminology: Common name, Official name Chrz (talk) 21:13, 9 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Or perhaps, Turkey or Türkiye, officially Republic of Türkiye. Beshogur (talk) 19:28, 4 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The name the country uses, Republic of Türkiye, should of course be noted both in infobox and lede. It already is, though, so I assume there's nothing to do in regards to this? Jeppiz (talk) 22:48, 4 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

-My ignorant opinion:
I can understand they wanting to deviate from the English word for turkey/bird..

Although in a way it should be irrelevant to them,
if ignorant English speakers mistake the name with whatever animal name/connotation, then it's the english speaker's problem/fault..
Turks shouldn't care of what another group of ppl understand,
and anyway in each and every language the name will be adapted differently..

However, I think the new orthography is also wrong/misleading to other languages.

For instance, me being Spanish/Catalan will read the word Turkiye just as it's written: Tur-ki-ye
But when you listen a Turkish person's pronunciation it's just like: Tur-kie

So yeah, now for being nitpicks everyone will start pronouncing it like Tur-ki-ye,
and then they will complain that it makes it sound more like russian/slav languajes..

Meanwhile in Spain we will keep calling it Turquia,
so what's the point? Quintessence7 (talk) 08:31, 5 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Precedent: Czechia registered in July 2016 -> Wikipedia adds "also known as Czechia" to LEDE in a matter of days. I think Türkiye is entitled to this too. Chrz (talk) 14:12, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

We should only say that it is "also known as Türkiye" if we can demonstrate that that is true, to any significant degree. Nobody has even tried to do that yet. Kahastok talk 17:06, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Is "known as" is too much? We can drop it to: "also Türkiye". Or add "in diplomatic circles". Chrz (talk) 17:30, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
No, it's too much WP:WEIGHT to give to this point, based on the actual level of usage. It belongs in the Name section. Kahastok talk 18:17, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It would result in the word Türkiye appearing four times in the opening sentence compared to Czechia appearing once in the first sentence of its article.. Overkill is another way of conveying WP:UNDUE. DeCausa (talk) 20:05, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
So? 2 of those are Turkish, you can hide them into a note, just like with the Czech Republic article (why are they hidden I don't know, maybe because of Bohemia it is "too much names" or whatever). "Türkiye" and "Republic of Türkiye" are two different proper nouns no matter they look similar. LEDE typically contains both: XYZ and Republic of XYZ (when formal political name is in such substantive form). Chrz (talk) 20:45, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It’s irrelevant that “2 of those are Turkish”. It’s a Turkish word. Why would would you hide them in a note. that makes no sense. Too much of this discussion is about making a point rather than thinking about conveying information to the reader. There’s already 3 words in the opeing sentence tells the English-speaking reader that Türkiye is a word for Turkey. We don’t need a fourth. The reader has well and truly got the message already. in the Czech Republic article the reader is told only once that Czechia is a word for the country. That’s the difference. DeCausa (talk) 20:59, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Your proposal: LEDE will not say that Türkiye is alternative English name of the country. THAT's the difference. It will say that Türkiye is Turkish name for the country and that political name in English is Republic of Türkiye. No word about "just Türkiye" in English, because reader can peel it off / deduce it from that "Republic of Türkiye"? Better just to say it than to create word puzzles for readers. Or hypotetic scenario: Türkiye becomes commonname - you say, do not include it in LEDE, too much Türkiyes. Strange. Chrz (talk) 21:10, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
”Puzzles for readers”. What are you talking about? It says “officially the Republic of Türkiye”. How can “also known as Türkiye“ possibly add anything worthwhile? It doesn’t. it’s just pointless and repetitive - and it’s on top of “(Turkish: Türkiye)” and “(Turkish: Türkiye Cumhuriyeti}”. How many times and how many different ways do we have to say that Türkiye means Turkey? DeCausa (talk)
I let someone else deal with it, someone who cares more. I am fed up with this "my opionion is THE TRUTH so consensus is what I say". "Türkiye" and "Republic of Türkiye" are two different proper nouns, they are both valid, we should list them both in full - that is worth a while. Chrz (talk) 21:25, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
‘"Türkiye" and "Republic of Türkiye" are two different proper nouns“‘ makes no sense. There’s only one proper noun, Türkiye, repeated twice. Once on its own and once with a modifier. It’s ironic that you complain about "my opionion is THE TRUTH so consensus is what I say" then go on to do exactly that: “they are both valid, we should list them both in full”!! DeCausa (talk) 21:46, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Czech Republic precedent - "also known as" in LEDE starts with UN registration. Or was it last straw?
Ivory Coast precedent - how to list names which are pushed into English but are clearly foreign in nature. "Why would would you hide them in a note. that makes no sense." Hm....
My way - precedents, analogies, custom practice, previous consensuses, bigger truth :P Chrz (talk) 22:00, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately “your way” isn’t Wikipedia’s way, per WP:OTHERCONTENT. We don’t do “precedent” in in that way because “anyone can edit an article”. WP:LOCALCONSENSUS is just that. DeCausa (talk) 22:05, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, let's do the same thing 10 different ways, just for the sake of it. First sentence is typical object of edit wars and then consensuses based on analogies. Examples of previous result help greatly, no need to hustle over the same thing all over. Chrz (talk) 22:09, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I’ve just realised you don’t have much WP experience. Consensus and approaches being different between articles is the norm and consensus within an article changes over time anyway. “Precedent” just doesn’t work here. Nothing, but nothing, is set in stone. That’s just how it is. DeCausa (talk) 22:25, 6 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Turkey, the victim at X-mas in Britain, US etc) is in German: TRUTHAHN. I would suggest :-) to change the present name of the country in: TRÜTHANIYE. By saving the Ü, of course.
Best from Germany. :-) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Orientalist (talk • contribs) 08:45, 7 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Unification of the first sentence is pretty common thing. Better resolve the format (formats) once than argue again and again with each and every article. Chrz (talk) 17:59, 7 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Fully agreed. While the lede implies that Türkiye is the name in Turkish, the fact that "Türkiye" (on its own) is an alternate name that exists IN ENGLISH is yet to be mentioned in the lede. Secondly, they ARE two different proper nouns. Thirdly, Ivory Coast's lede begins with "Ivory Coast, also known as Côte d'Ivoire, officially the Republic of Côte d'Ivoire". East Timor's lede begins with "East Timor, also known as Timor-Leste, officially the Democratic Republic of Timor-Leste". i.e. BOTH of them mention all three forms of the name "XXX, also known as YYY, officially the Republic of YYY". The words "Turkey, also known as Türkiye" should be added to the lede. Paintspot Infez (talk) 18:20, 8 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I would say that the "also known as" isn't required if the official name includes the alternate name --Spekkios (talk) 08:33, 9 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Talk:List_of_sovereign_states#Differences Chrz (talk) 17:55, 9 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Source link from the United Nations: Turkiye –Furkan (talk) 16:31, 10 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I think we can use “Turkiye” from the title. But we should also add ”Türkiye”, which is the official name, to the introductory sentence. –Furkan (talk) 16:36, 10 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
+Source link from UEFA: UEFA –Furkan (talk) 18:56, 11 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
If the title isn't changed to Turkiye then the North Macedonia article should revert back to Macedonia. DOMINATOR1000 (talk) 14:58, 15 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Turkey to "Türkiye"

I think we should change the shorthand name to Türkiye as well considering that's what its officially now know as, will be the common term referring to it going forward and would just be confusing to have contradicting names on this page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7F:14B4:3400:C469:D25F:D0EA:5F3E (talk) 08:51, 11 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Pretty hypocritical how trans people who change their names get their articles renamed the very same day, but when a country with millions of people changes their name, the opinions of the UN and some randos on wikipedia somehow matter more than their own government. Stop the selectiveness and hypocrisy. They are Turkiye now, simple as that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.100.192.236 (talk) 22:11, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. How can we have one rule for North Macedonia, but a different one for this article? A name has been changed, it should reflect that in the same way that it has for the North Macedonia article. DOMINATOR1000 (talk) 14:56, 15 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The name had not changed, Turkey simply ordered that the Turkish variant of it's name should be used in other languages. It can not order that, it can only ask that. Every language decides for itself witch names to use. Turkey has no authority over the English language. Türkiye is clearly not an English name, it does not follow English orthographic rules, therefore it's completely logic that the name will have more difficulties to catch on.--2A02:1811:CD07:E900:FD8A:1739:C6EA:C240 (talk) 22:09, 17 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I see that some ip or new editors are constantinly changing these articles related to Turkey, for example: Grand National Assembly of Turkey, President of Turkey, etc. We have few options, should we:

  • 1: change all of them to "... of Türkiye" (title as well)
  • 2: add "... of Turkey or Türkiye"
  • 3: add "... of Turkey/Türkiye"
  • 4: add "... of Turkey, officially the ... of Türkiye"

opinions? If someone can make this a rfc, it could be helpful. Beshogur (talk) 12:21, 12 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Per MOS:GEO, A place should generally be referred to consistently by the same name as in the title of its article. Since this article title has not changed, the default position is that we make no change to these articles.
There is an exception in MOS:GEO when there is a widely accepted historical English name appropriate to the given context, but this is not the case here. There are also cases where we are quoting a source where quotations should be reserved, but this is also not the case here.
If we have new editors who are continually changing articles against the MOS or consensus, there are tools we have at our disposal to resolve this. Kahastok talk 12:35, 12 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Since this article title has not changed, the default position is that we make no change to these articles. But those are self referring officially as "Türkiye" at this point, that's the question. Beshogur (talk) 13:02, 12 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I think at least this ISO_3166-2 and this Member_states_of_the_United_Nations must contain the form that is officially registered there. And it seems it checks - notice Russian Federation (no Russia even though the article IS named Russia), another examples: "Venezuela (Bolivarian Republic of)", "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland", "Cabo Verde", "Republic of Moldova", "Viet Nam" and mooore. Same with sports "Great Britain men's national ice hockey team", not United Kingdom... Unification does not reach there now, so it should not with Türkiye either. In these cases just copy what sources say, do not push the consistency too far. Chrz (talk) 16:05, 12 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
You probably don't get my question. Those organizations call themselves like "Türkiye" as well. My question was, how the lead should be written. Beshogur (talk) 16:26, 12 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Looks like my question was not clear. I skipped the part of changing titles, however those various government organizations changed their name as well. Thus, this means their official names changed as well. So, my question is, how are we supposed to add "Türkiye" to the titles, see my options. Beshogur (talk) 08:48, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

To make it even clearer: Should we make our own English translations of Turkish government agencies, or should we copy whatever THEY prepared for us in English? Chrz (talk) 09:08, 15 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Which government agency did we make our own translation for? At any rate, THEY curiously used two different transliterations there on the one page. CMD (talk) 10:40, 15 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Just an observation: UEFA using Türkiye

I'm aware that this might just add to the pot of discussion but here goes. I notice that UEFA uses the spelling Türkiye - https://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro/history/teams/135--turkey/ doktorb wordsdeeds 10:56, 13 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

NATO uses it as well. Beshogur (talk) 11:29, 13 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
If the word Türkiye has started to be used in international usage, it is necessary to make the necessary arrangements here as well. Jelican9 (talk) 15:03, 13 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
No, it isn't. Ukraine petitioned the Wikimedia Foundation to change Kiev to Kyiv in 2015. The consensus to switch to the latter on English Wikipedia wasn't made until 2020.
These things take time. Frevangelion (talk) 20:39, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
That's a bit weird, isn't it? If you look at the UEFA list of teams they use the English name for every other team, but the Turkish name for Turkey. They don't call Italy "Repubblica Italiana" or Germany "Bundesrepublik Deutschland", for example. I'm sure there's a logical explanation but I'm unsure what it is! Black Kite (talk) 07:37, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps because Germany and Italy have not asked for their countries to be known by those names, while the Türkiye government has? It adds evidence to those who use real world usage as reason for Wikipedia to change article titles or the opening paragraph. doktorb wordsdeeds 07:59, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
NATO and UEFA adopting this so quickly is a sign of wide international acceptance to the English use of Türkiye. --StellarNerd (talk) 20:46, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Not really, no. It is common for these sorts of organisations to adapt to these sorts of requests as soon as they are made. In fact, it is somewhat surprising that the UK and US governments haven't done so yet.
If media organisations - specifically, mainstream English-speaking media outlets in English-speaking countries - start systematically using Türkiye instead of Turkey when discussing the country outside the context of the rename, then that would suggest that we might be nearing the point where a move should be taken seriously. And even then, that wouldn't necessarily mean it should happen. Kahastok talk 21:33, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Name change

It is disrespectful to disregard the will of Turkiye to rename the country. Thank you for your consideration. 2A01:C22:D471:EA00:3C1A:8343:FC86:A2BB (talk) 18:41, 15 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Cabo Verde, Czechia, Timor-Leste, Côte d'Ivoire, Viet Nam... So now the club of Wikipedia's disrespect and disregard welcomes Türkiye (or Turkiye?!) :) "Will" is not enough. Chrz (talk) 20:42, 15 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Rhodesia, Siam, Ceylon, Burma and many other countries will to change their names was accepted, why not Turkeys will, too? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:C22:D471:EA00:3C1A:8343:FC86:A2BB (talk) 22:28, 15 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Discussed 100 times already. Those were "accepted" by newpaper, media, books. Chrz (talk) 04:28, 16 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Just for comparison: other than discussion about the history of Siam/Thailand (primarily, but not limited to, discussion about the musical The King and I), and a couple of fixed phrases which use the word "Siamese" (a type of cat and conjoined twins), I don't think I had ever seen or heard the word Siam in any form. Animal lover |666| 14:02, 16 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I guess you are young. I grew up with the name Siam and even the Pouges sing a song about "Summer in Siam" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:C22:CC33:6C00:3C1A:8343:FC86:A2BB (talk) 00:07, 17 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It is disrespectful of erdogan to demand a change to a localized name with a long tradition just to get some nationalist voters on his side. as this is just that, a PR stunt, nothing should happen until the next election is over Norschweden (talk) 23:01, 17 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I am a bit concerned about the participation of Swedish and Finnish Wikipedians in discussions relating to the Turkey name change issue. Due to the recent NATO membership conflict involving Sweden, Finland, and Turkey, relationships between these countries deteriorated a lot. The comments made by Swedish or Finnish Wikipedians in this talk page were clearly politically motivated and biased. Some of them are deleting other people's comments and accusing them as being "nationalists" while themselves were totally intolerant and acted in an unreasonable manner.
In order to avoid potential conflict, my suggestion is that Swedish or Finnish Wikipedians should refrain from participating in "Turkey name change"-related discussions any further as there is no way they could maintain WP:NPOV in this issue. Thank you for your cooperation. 2001:8003:9008:1301:1DEC:6878:4502:E89B (talk) 03:40, 20 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 June 2022

"Turkey" should be changed to "Türkiye" 46.114.91.126 (talk) 21:12, 17 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 June 2022

2A02:842A:84B8:5B01:4C0E:9AC6:69EA:BAA1 (talk) 15:34, 18 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Türkiye

comment I assume you are referring to the news that the President of Turkey wants the country to be called "Türkiye" In my opinion, this should not be edited yet, until there is wide adoption of the name by the media. The Wikipedia policy is to use the widely used version of the name. Elliswiki7 (talk) 18:51, 18 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
 Not done: Get consensus first. See similar requests on this page. RudolfRed (talk) 22:21, 18 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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