Talk:Korn: Difference between revisions

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{{WikiProject Biography|living=yes|class=GA|musician-priority=mid|musician-work-group=yes|listas=Korn}}

{{WikiProject Korn|class=GA}}

{{WikiProject Rock music|class=GA|importance=mid}}

{{WikiProject Metal|class=GA|importance=mid}}

==Blast Beats==

I got a laugh out of the phrase "Metallica-esque blast beats." Metallica does not now, nor have they ever, used blast beats in any of their recorded material. Much less should such a thing be considered a Metallica signature, or its use considered "Metallica-esque". [[Special:Contributions/216.246.225.57|216.246.225.57]] ([[User talk:216.246.225.57|talk]]) 13:42, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

==A question==

where the name Korn comes from, why they chose thta name??--[[User:DanTorresROCKS|DanTorresROCKS]] ([[User talk:DanTorresROCKS|talk]]) 23:49, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

hit me up on aim and ill tell you, i have this book that explains it, i wrote it all here but then the internet crashed and i didnt wanna write it all over again haha my screenname is NOTBRENDANMALLEY [[User:Branden mellay|Branden mellay]] ([[User talk:Branden mellay|talk]])

==No section about their musical style and influence?==

I'm very surprised that there is no section about Korn's musical style, influence's, and influence on other bands. I would especially think that a band like Korn would have this section since they are credited as [[nu metal|creating a popular genre of music]] and have influenced many bands, [[Slipknot (band)|Slipknot]] has this section but yet they have yet to be considered an influential band.[[User:Xx1994xx|Xx1994xx]] ([[User talk:Xx1994xx|talk]])

==Its not Rock==

You know what. You might as well change korn to a "Music" band if you want to be vague...--[[Special:Contributions/75.139.107.252|75.139.107.252]] ([[User talk:75.139.107.252|talk]]) 10:44, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

:And how exactly is Korn not a rock band?--[[User:F-22 Raptored|<span style="color:#800517;">猛禽22</span>]] ^{[[User_talk:F-22_Raptored|•]][[Special:Contributions/F-22 Raptored|•]]} 12:58, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

It's an extremely vague term and insults me as a fan. That doesn't mean wikipedia has to change it. But it does nonetheless make me angry with the editors. Rock is like that old CRAP from the 60s. KORN IS NU METAL, GET OVER IT!--[[Special:Contributions/75.139.107.252|75.139.107.252]] ([[User talk:75.139.107.252|talk]]) 01:25, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

::Nu metal is a sub-genre of Rock music. So saying that the band is a rock band is 100% accurate because nu metal is rock. [[User:GripTheHusk|GripTheHusk]] ([[User talk:GripTheHusk|talk]]) 01:30, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

::I give up, call it rock if you want, it still isnt. Its nu metal. All these dumb wikipedia editors favor lies over facts.--[[Special:Contributions/75.139.107.252|75.139.107.252]] ([[User talk:75.139.107.252|talk]]) 20:53, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

That's the whole problem right there. Rock and metal are two different genres. It is insulting to a Metal band to be called Rock. You don't Label a Blues artist as Electro or a Jazz artist as Country do you? Metal is its own genre and deserves it's own classification. Nú Metal is a sub-genre of Metal. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— [[Wikipedia:MisterAaft|MisterAaft]] ([[User talk:MisterAaft|talk]]) 17:05, 8 July 2010 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:MisterAaft --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:: To the original post above: Not sure if srs. Really, get over it. It insults you as a fan? Really? -_-[[Special:Contributions/69.249.223.63|69.249.223.63]] ([[User talk:69.249.223.63|talk]]) 18:55, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

I totally agree with 75.139.107.252 Metal and Rock are two different things. Unfourtunately, '''SOME''' people prefer to stay completely literal. It really bugs me. [[User:The Shadow-Fighter|The Shadow-Fighter]] ([[User talk:The Shadow-Fighter|talk]]) 20:12, 15 June 2011 (UTC)

:::Metal came from Rock music. Rock 'n' roll is subgenre of rock, and that is "shit" from 60s. Rock is global term for any music that uses electric guitars and drums, and have it's characteristic style of melody and singing.[[Корисник:Serbianboy|<font color="blue" face="Metal Lord">VuXman</font>]] <strong>[[Разговор са корисником:Serbianboy|^{<span style="color:red">talk</span>}]]</strong> 18:14, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

korn are part of a wave of music that emerged in the 80s & 90s called "hard alternative rock" (more commonly known as alternative metal or ''nu metal'') so yes technically they are rock not metal, and korn fans insistence on putting nu metal over rock just goes to show how obsessed nu metal fans are with trying to prove how "metal" and "brootol hardcore" their bands are which is why everyone hates nu metal and bands like korn. <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:I call the big one bitey|I call the big one bitey]] ([[User talk:I call the big one bitey|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/I call the big one bitey|contribs]]) 17:19, 10 June 2012 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

Metal is a sub-genre of rock music, the same way punk is, saying it's not is just stupid to be honest, metal is pretty much harder hard rock, a genre doesn't become it's own genre just be being heavier, saying metal is it's own genre is like saying hardcore punk is it's own genre and not a sub-genre of punk.--[[Special:Contributions/84.13.85.148|84.13.85.148]] ([[User talk:84.13.85.148|talk]]) 00:42, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

==Changing the name of the unreleased new album to left out==

whoever changed that needs to read the comments on youtube videos, left out was the name given by the idiot that posted all the Flymore songs (band that sounds alot like korn) saying they were korn and that was the name of the album. [[User:Drugyourlove|Drugyourlove]] Monday, July 27th, 2009. 12:55 am <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|undated]] comment added 04:56, 27 July 2009 (UTC).</span><!--Template:Undated--> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== David Silveria on "Dancing with the Stars"? LOL WTF? ==

This is from his page: "For the first time in three years David appeared promoting Lil Kim in Dancing with the Stars." Is there a source for that? If so, I'd like to see it, I bet it's funny! [[Special:Contributions/98.174.219.202|98.174.219.202]] ([[User talk:98.174.219.202|talk]]) 00:44, 12 July 2009 (UTC)</br>

Well if it's on his page then you should ask there. [[User:Llama lom|Daeth]] ([[User talk:Llama lom|talk]]) 13:40, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

== Slipknot ==

" Korn borrows elements from such acts as Pantera, Jane's Addiction, ""Slipknot"", Rage Against the Machine, Primus, Helmet, Faith No More, Mr.Bungle,..."

LOL! Korn borrows from slipknot? thats funny... anyway the actual quote from allmusic doesn't say slipknot so I'm removing them from the list. [[User:Ducky610|Ducky610]] ([[User talk:Ducky610|talk]]) 04:37, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

Yeah it should be the other way around. [[User:Llama lom|Daeth]] ([[User talk:Llama lom|talk]]) 16:06, 25 October 2009 (UTC)slipknot took from korn

== Follow the Leader ==

Hi, im looking for a source for the 9 million copies sold of Follow the Leader. I found [http://www.riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=SEARCH_RESULTS this] but im not sure what it means. Maybe someone can help. Thanks [[User:Portillo|Portillo]] ([[User talk:Portillo|talk]]) 02:07, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

== changing title genres ==

This has to stop. Ever since the protection was lifted, people are once again changing this from rock to metal. I remember in a previous argument saying that rock is favored over the metal genre since it's a bigger umbrella term, but now I'm looking for other people's opinions on what we should do. Should we just change it to metal and make everyone happy, or take the hard route and request another semi-protection?--[[User:F-22 Raptored|<span style="color:#800517;">猛禽22</span>]] ^{[[User_talk:F-22_Raptored|•]][[Special:Contributions/F-22 Raptored|•]]} 22:55, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

:No answer? I'm changing it to metal.--[[User:F-22 Raptored|<span style="color:#800517;">猛禽22</span>]] ^{[[User_talk:F-22_Raptored|•]][[Special:Contributions/F-22 Raptored|•]]} 02:49, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

::Im happier with it being called metal than rock. It is more decriptive. Calling Korn "Rock" is like calling a vehicle an "Object" just because its an umbrella term that vaguely describes it. --[[Special:Contributions/75.139.107.252|75.139.107.252]] ([[User talk:75.139.107.252|talk]]) 23:03, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

:::Earlier I did favour "rock", but now I agree that it is too broad. But it should be "''heavy'' metal", which I changed it to a little while ago. The reason for this is because "metal" isn't the proper name for the genre, the genre is called "heavy metal". If we call it a "metal" band that'd be like referring to Iron Maiden or Black Sabbath as "Sabbath" or "Maiden" on their pages. Other similar bands such as Slipknot and Godsmack also have "heavy metal" in the lead. [[User:Ximmerman|Ximmerman]] ([[User talk:Ximmerman|talk]]) 14:53, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Alternative metal and nu metal are definately korn's main genre [[User:Metalfan72|Metalfan72]] ([[User talk:Metalfan72|talk]]) 20:43, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

::::However, even in [[Billboard]] they are referred to as Hard Rock. Just because a consensus is reached once, doesn't mean a consensus might need to change. Refer to [[WP:CCC]]. Apparently more discussion is needed to come to another consensus. [[Korn]] have changed a lot since this last "consensus" was done. If a citation can validate one or many genre's, it shouldn't be thrown out just because a person believes it to be invalid or non-applicable because a consensus was reached "a long time ago". [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 22:18, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

== New album==

Has not had its title announced. It is not Korn II. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/122.107.196.44|122.107.196.44]] ([[User talk:122.107.196.44|talk]]) 03:43, 24 January 2010 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Backwards R, "do not change" comment ==

Firstly, I'd love to add "do not change" comments to all my edits that I'm "real sure" should not be changed, but on Wikipedia that's irrelevant for obvious reasons. I've removed the comment.

Secondly, regardless of what the backwards R symbol available during Wikipedia page editing is meant to represent, it still is visually identical to a backwards English letter R which is needed to spell the stylized version of Korn, so there's no reason we can't use it as such. I've therefore made that edit as well.

Just wanted to expand on my edit summary. If anyone has any argument against either of these edits feel free to comment. <font face="Century Gothic">[[User:Equazcion|<span style="color:#000080">'''Equazcion'''</span>]] <small>[[User talk:Equazcion|'''^{(<span style="color:#007BA7">talk</span>)}''']]</small> 23:42, 2 Feb 2010 (UTC)</font>

:First, a backwards R is as "visually identical" to a [[Ya (Cyrillic)|ya]] as a lowercase [[L|l]] is to a capital [[I|i]] and the [[1 (numeral)|numeral 1]], and just as interchangeable. --&nbsp;[[User:C. A. Russell|C.&nbsp;A.&nbsp;Russell]]&nbsp;(<small>[[User talk:C. A. Russell|talk]]</small>) 23:26, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

PS. If you look at the source code of korn.com, the same character is used for the meta content and page title. <font face="Century Gothic">[[User:Equazcion|<span style="color:#000080">'''Equazcion'''</span>]] <small>[[User talk:Equazcion|'''^{(<span style="color:#007BA7">talk</span>)}''']]</small> 19:05, 3 Feb 2010 (UTC)</font>

:So the web designer is someone who likes to shit all over Unicode and semantics. That doesn't mean that when Davis scrawled out the "logo" he meant for the third letter to be a ya. --&nbsp;[[User:C. A. Russell|C.&nbsp;A.&nbsp;Russell]]&nbsp;(<small>[[User talk:C. A. Russell|talk]]</small>) 23:26, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

:If people do happen to use this backwards R character even on websites, and the website on korn.com happens to use the Я in Korn, the part saying "typeset as KoЯn" is indeed accurate, reversed R or not, because it comes down to not how the letter is used, it is how frequent it happens to be used. My two cents.--[[User:F-22 Raptored|<span style="color:#557777">F-22 Raptör</span>]]^{[[User talk:F-22 Raptored|<span style="color:#0B5394;" font="Stencil">Aces High</span>]]♠} 01:04, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

== "My Time" Leaked Korn song... ==

Read the section on Korns 9th album, it states

<blockquote>"Rumor began to circulate that the song would be cut from the album. When asked via Twitter to confirm this rumor, Ross confirmed that it was indeed an album cut."</blockquote>

This is an unclear statement, when he was asked to confirm that the song WOULD BE CUT FROM THE ALBUM, and he replied that it would INDEED BE AN ALBUM CUT.

Can someone just tell me if it's going on the album or not, no wiki jargon thanks! :) <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/79.66.177.81|79.66.177.81]] ([[User talk:79.66.177.81|talk]]) 17:26, 5 March 2010 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:Source?--[[User:F-22 Raptored|<span style="color:#557777">F-22 Raptör</span>]]^{[[User talk:F-22 Raptored|<span style="color:#0B5394;" font="Stencil">Aces High</span>]]♠} 20:40, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

:: The source is Ross Robinson's twitter - google it. I think him saying, "It's an album cut," may have been an amusing way of fucking with fans as the question was if the song was cut or not - it can be taken either way. Until it's absolutely confirmed, I'd say it should be taken literally: saying, "It's an album cut," would mean that it IS on the album. This is likely the actual truth anyway, maybe I'm thinking Ross is more clever than he really is. [[Special:Contributions/68.32.194.67|68.32.194.67]] ([[User talk:68.32.194.67|talk]]) 10:07, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

== online leak ==

I keep removing a claim that July 1, 2010, studio album [[Korn III - Remember Who You Are]] was leaked online in its entirety due to lack of source. Please don't add it without source. And no, a username (on what system?) does not count as a source. --[[User:Muhandes|Muhandes]] ([[User talk:Muhandes|talk]]) 11:45, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Why don't you check for yourself? It leaked. Everywhere. Youtube, torrent sites, rapidshare, you name it. It's out there. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/65.96.247.28|65.96.247.28]] ([[User talk:65.96.247.28|talk]]) 16:23, 2 July 2010 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

: [[WP:V]] and [[WP:NOR]]. --[[User:Muhandes|Muhandes]] ([[User talk:Muhandes|talk]]) 16:46, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

:I still fail to see how album leaks are even [[WP:N|notable]]. [[User:5theye|= ∫]]_{[[User talk:5theye|t]]}^{[[Special:Contributions/5theye|c]]} [[User:5theye|5th Eye]] 16:50, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

MEH, what ever. I give up on this <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/65.96.247.28|65.96.247.28]] ([[User talk:65.96.247.28|talk]]) 18:17, 2 July 2010 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

the leak is notable because its going to lose millions for the band. why would you even question it being noteable? <--i asked that like a normal questio not in like a douchey way as it comes off haha. sorry that it does [[User:Branden mellay|Branden mellay]] ([[User talk:Branden mellay|talk]])

I dont see the point in noting it as leaks happen all the time. Nothing special to Korn. But I can see it may be interesting to some for the history of music how soon leaks happen before release. Especially if there is controversy with accidental leaks and unfinished songs. [[User:Dralezero|Dralezero]] ([[User talk:Dralezero|talk]]) <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|undated]] comment added 00:14, 3 July 2010 (UTC).</span><!--Template:Undated--> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

Well, i will admit when im wrong, adn i was, thats a good point, this was leaked with finished songs. i agree with you guys. [[User:Branden mellay|Branden mellay]] ([[Branden mellay|talk]]) <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|undated]] comment added 01:43, 3 July 2010 (UTC).</span><!--Template:Undated--> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== No Mention of Nightmare Revisited ==

There is no mention of the song they covered for the album Nightmare Revisited, released in 2008. They preformed the song "Kidnap Mister Sandy Claus." It deserves mentioning.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nightmare_Revisited

[[Special:Contributions/72.165.54.237|72.165.54.237]] ([[User talk:72.165.54.237|talk]]) 18:45, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

{{Talk:Korn/GA1}}

== cooliolishish ==

what is this word? the mtv interview does not mention it??? <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/83.70.253.29|83.70.253.29]] ([[User talk:83.70.253.29|talk]]) 19:42, 25 February 2011 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== backwards letters ==

How do you get backwards Rs? For that matter, how do you get any backwards letters? I've tried symbols on here and I've tried symbols on Word. HOW DO YOU GET BACKWARDS LETTERS?! [[User:The Shadow-Fighter|The Shadow-Fighter]] ([[User talk:The Shadow-Fighter|talk]]) 20:14, 15 June 2011 (UTC)

:You don't. Please read [[MOS:TM]]. --[[User:IllaZilla|IllaZilla]] ([[User talk:IllaZilla|talk]]) 21:15, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

== Reasons for introduction stating Korn as a "rock" band. ==

Do not change the introduction genre from [[rock music|rock]] to [[nu metal]]. Nu metal is a fusion genre of [[heavy metal music|heavy metal]]; which itself is a genre of rock. The introduction needs to state it's '''main genre''', in this case, rock. ''Any'' edits to change the genre '''''without''''' reliable sources will be reverted. Thank you. [[User:GWPSP090|<font color= "#347235">'''<b>GWPSP</b>'''</font>]][[User talk:GWPSP090|<font color= "#151B8D">'''<b>Ø9Ø</b>'''</font>]][[Special:Contributions/GWPSP090|<font color= "#800517">''<small><b><u>7thAdv.</u></b></small>''</font>]] 05:55, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

:I think that the issue was previouslly discussed above, so please go and give a look there[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Korn#Its_not_Rock]. if so you will see that it's not ok to give that general examples to a genre because it makes wikipedia imprecise and thus an unreliable source, i bet that if you go on a grab a physical enciclopedia about contemporany music, korn will be listed as A)- Metal B)- Nu metal. i appeal to your neutral point of view here. And please don't change the genre again untill a real consensous (I mean, one involving more users than you) being reached. Better regards: [[User:Ledforce|Ledforce]] ([[User talk:Ledforce|talk]]) 04:19, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

== Korn page is a mess! ==

Wow! Absolutely atrocious! I can't believe how bad Korn's wiki page is! I'm willing to help out, but only if Wikipedia allows me to cite Kornspace.com as an source. It is simply not worth my time if they refuse that request because most of Korn's news is released through Kornspace.com [[User:Tjohnsond|Tjohnsond]] ([[User talk:Tjohnsond|talk]]) 14:02, 26 August 2011 (UTC)

== new album ==

The new album, [[The Path of Totality]] is obviously [[dubstep]]. No arguing with that. It's not because Skrillex is involved. It's because if you listen to it, you'll hear all that sound that dubstep has. Just if you look up what dubstep is, you'll know. I cited my source while adding dubstep(recently) to the genre list korn has.<ref name=roadrunnerrecords1 /> <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:TheMetallican|TheMetallican]] ([[User talk:TheMetallican|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/TheMetallican|contribs]]) 21:55, 11 March 2012 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:One album isn't enough. [[User:yawaraey|yawaraey]] <small>([[User talk:yawaraey|talk]])</small> 00:18, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

So? We just put [[dubstep]](recently) there. <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:TheMetallican|TheMetallican]] ([[User talk:TheMetallican|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/TheMetallican|contribs]]) 23:16, 12 March 2012 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Bands influenced by Korn ==

Can we get direct sources from the members of the bands listed DIRECTLY STATING that their band was influenced by Korn? Allmusic's overview section (to distinguish from their biographies -- the biographies are usually written by people, the overview generation seems to be computer-generated) is not a good source for tracking artist influences, because they mostly seem to categorize bands as "following" other bands simply for having a similar style or location (I.E., numerous rappers from Detroit categorized as being "influenced" by Eminem, even if they started out before Eminem). --[[User:Wisdomtenacityfocus|WTF]] ([[User talk:Wisdomtenacityfocus|talk]]) 00:28, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

== alternative rock & hard rock ==

ima go get sources <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/27.32.220.148|27.32.220.148]] ([[User talk:27.32.220.148|talk]]) 23:43, 10 May 2012 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Heavy metal and Nu metal ==

The band [[Korn]] have been considered the pioneers of the [[Nu Metal]] sound. Their genre has been criticized by some [[heavy metal music|metal]] purists to have been not real heavy metal. Due to controversies and arguments over the band being heavy metal or not than just with nu metal being heavy metal or not, here's what lead singer [[Jonathan Davis]] said about it. “There’s a lot of closed-minded metal purists that would hate something because it’s not true to metal or whatever, but Korn has never been a metal band, dude. We’re not a metal band.” He continued, “We’ve always been looked as as what they called the nu-metal thing. But we’ve always been the black sheep and we never fitted into that kind of thing so … We’re always ever evolving, and we always piss fans off and we’re gaining other fans and it is how it is.”

Another quote

"I remember when were coming out we were fighting being called a metal band because we weren't a metal band, we were something that wasn't classifiable," Davis says. "Then they came up with 'nu-metal' but that's still cheesy. It's frustrating."

<ref name=http://korn.simpol.net/index.php?subaction=showcomments&id=1147094704&archive=1278501972&start_from=&ucat=5&page=88 />

<ref name=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7vPcGRTVuA />

<ref name=http://loudwire.com/korn-jonathan-davis-were-not-a-metal-band/ />

== can someone change the main photo? ==

they don't look like korn, they look like a bunch of imposters <small><span class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:I call the big one bitey|I call the big one bitey]] ([[User talk:I call the big one bitey|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/I call the big one bitey|contribs]]) 16:56, 10 June 2012 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

: I will upload an updated photo on the Wikimedia Commons and update the photo. Josie Borisow 13:57, 21 November 2012 (UTC) Josie Borisow 19:11, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

:: Done. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] Josie Borisow 19:06, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Whoever changed the picture THANK YOU. It has been the same for 6 years now. [[User:Teresa44|Teresa44]] ([[User talk:Teresa44|talk]]) 21:08, 27 November 2012 (UTC)

: You're welcome! ;) [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 21:13, 27 November 2012 (UTC)

== this is KoЯn, not Korn ==

the band is named KoЯn --[[Special:Contributions/82.139.5.13|82.139.5.13]] ([[User talk:82.139.5.13|talk]]) 10:46, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

==Genre==

Before you post hiddent text, you might want to consider reading about Wikipedia's "don't revert due solely to "no consensus" policy" [[WP:DRNC]] [[Korn]] have said themselves many times they are not nu-metal or even metal at all. They fit into many categories of music. A consensus may or may not be necessary but to put a hidden text telling everyone they can't edit the article is against Wikipedia policy. [[WP:Hidden]] I have seen several people cite that a "consensus" needs to be reached before making any edits to the genre, yet no one has started an actual consensus! [[WP:CONS]] No single person owns this wikipedia article, therefore, changes can be made to any information at any time by any one without regards to hidden texts telling them they can't change it. If you feel so strongly that there should be a consensus, then start one, don't just state that no one should/can change it until a consensus is reached when you never started one. Thank you. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 14:21, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

:However, even in Billboard they are referred to as Hard Rock. Just because a consensus is reached once, doesn't mean a consensus might need to change. Refer to WP:CCC. Apparently more discussion is needed to come to another consensus. Korn have changed a lot since this last "consensus" was done. If a citation can validate one or many genre's, it shouldn't be thrown out just because a person believes it to be invalid or non-applicable because a consensus was reached "a long time ago". With that said, [[nu metal]] is defined in wikipedia as a subgenre of heavy metal and classed as alternative metal. Korn themselves have always said that they aren't metal and even they don't know how to classify their music. They have had so many styles incorporated into their sound its going to be difficult to come up with only one genre to define them unless you keep it very broad, such as [[rock music]]. Besides, where does it say that a band must only be classified as one genre? Is this a rule in wikipedia that I'm not aware of? [[slipknot (band)|Slipknot]] has 3 genre's listed, [[Deftones]] have 2 genre's listed, even [[nu metal]] isn't on theirs yet they are classified in the same categories as Korn are. Go look at the list of [[List of nu metal bands]] and tell me how many of those bands ONLY have 1 genre listed as their genre. I see no reason why multiple genre's can't be listed for Korn. My suggestions would be the following: [[nu metal]], [[rock]], [[industrial metal]], [[alternative metal]], and possibly even [[electronica]] due to the incorporation of electronica in their latest album, [[The Path of Totality]]. Take a look at the [[List of alternative metal artists]] and [[List of industrial metal bands]] and you'll see how Korn can easily fit in each of those categories as well as [[nu metal]] and [[rock]]. I do feel that even one album such as [[The Path of Totality]] can add a new genre to their style because they have always evolved throughout the years from one style to the next fusing many genres into their style. But that's only my opinion. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 20:24, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

== Record Sales ==

Spoke to artist management this morning and the actual number is in the 30 million range. Nielsen Soundscan has total US sales are 19,509,563 as of this week. Will continue to look for a citation to add to this number, but this is the most accurate number available as of today. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 20:25, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

{{Edit protected|ans=yes}}

:Would like to add this reference for 35 million record sales. [http://www.msopr.com/n/client-roster/korn/] Thank you! [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 01:34, 8 February 2013 (UTC)

::{{EP|nlp}} --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 12:37, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

== Consensus for the genre ==

There has been WAY TOO MUCH genre warring lately on this page. Since December when someone added [[industrial metal]] with [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Korn&diff=527181270&oldid=527028665 this edit] to the genre field for [[Korn]] with NO sources or even discussing it here. Sure we've seen the musical style and influences whatever section, but we're '''''not''''' going to add all those genres to the field. [[Nu metal]] is a hybrid of metal, grunge and rap. Thus, it is NOT [[hard rock]]. The band only played industrial metal in 2005. Please see the sources for [[See you on the other side]] and read the article. And I guess 2007 maybe. But that article's genre field wasn't sourced with ''industrial metal''. If you look at their other stuff, they are [[nu metal]]. Industrial metal is Static-X, Ministry, Rammstein, etc. Then someone added a source in the genre field to allow industrial metal on there, but all genres got put in the musical style section, industrial metal was there, but long ago there openly was a consensus made for the genre to say ((((([[Nu metal]], [[alternative metal]]))))) and the [[list of industrial metal bands]] article did NOT have korn in there, but you can't source wikipedia for itself. Anyone can edit it. Also, that article is barely sourced anyways. Another thing is that if the consensus was made, I reverted to pre-genre war state. Before 12/9/2012. An IP also vandalized a section in the page calling the members "homosexuals" and talking about their name having to do with diarrhea or corn or something. It was ridiculous and unsourced and obvious vandalism. Also, the sources for their formation year '''''SPECIFICALLY''''' say they formed in '''''1992'''''. NOT 1993. The band only experimented [[industrial metal]] (precisely 'nu-industrial') with [[See You On the Other Side]], and MAYBE [[Evolution (album)|Evolution]]. It just was unsourced. But for SYOTOS it WAS. Please don't edit the genre without a discussion.

[[Special:Contributions/2601:A:4100:5A:A538:D76B:C74F:B580|2601:A:4100:5A:A538:D76B:C74F:B580]] ([[User talk:2601:A:4100:5A:A538:D76B:C74F:B580|talk]]) 01:40, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

:You should consider reading about Ownership of articles [[WP:OWN]]. The one consensus that was done before is no longer valid if others now feel that other genre's should be added. Anyone can edit the article. You are no more entitled to this than any other. Billboard is a valid and reliable source by the way. This "edit warring" is actually you. Mulitple people come and change the genre, not just one. By this comment, "but we're not going to add all those genres to the field", who are the "we're" you are referring to? Do you speak for every member of wikipedia that makes updates to [[Korn]]'s wikipedia articles? The band only changes their musical style every single album! None of them are the same so it's completely valid to add additional genre's for their genre. Many other bands have multiple genre's listed as their genre so why can't [[Korn]]? Why would you revert this page back to 9 Dec for no valid reason? Just for the genre? [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 02:04, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

::[[User:Myxomatosis57]] Please stop reverting additions just because YOU feel that the source is not reliable. [[Allmusic]] IS considered a reliable source. You keep reverting on the page but have not contributed to the talk page. You have been given an [[WP:EDITWAR]] warning. Please stop reverting other's inputs, particularly when they have cited valid and reliable sources. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 20:02, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

::::[[User:Myxomatosis57]] I read your link to [[WP: ALBUMS]] and even there they state, as the consensus, that the overarching genre used on [[Allmusic]] is an acceptable reference. Only 1 person disagreed amongst the 5 people involved in the discussion. Therefore, [[electronic music]] and [[pop rock]] is a valid genre to list for [[Korn]] [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 20:15, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

:::::My point is that [[Allmusic]] '''reviews''' are the reliable texts. Nevertheless, the '''genre sidebar''', the sidebar next to the reviews which provably have actually no relationship with the reviews, is not. Nearly every band and review are branded with generalized "pop/rock" or "electronic" or etc., which actually makes the sidebar obsolete. For instance, user page of [[Mayhem (band)|Mayhem]] also contains [http://www.allmusic.com/artist/mayhem-mn0000335302 pop/rock labeling], but they're obviously not "pop rock". The users who participated in the consensus I've send also can be showing distaste/disapproval for the sidebar while totally agreeing upon the accepted usage of the written review itself. Another question-answer session regarding this issue can be seen [[Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard/Archive_130#Sidebox.|here]]. Apart from that, I've been warned twice by other users not to refer to the genre sidebar, as it can be seen from [[User_talk:Myxomatosis57/Archive_1#Genre_addition|here]] and [[User_talk:Myxomatosis57/Archive_1#Genre_changes|here]]. I'd like to make an exact quote from one of them:

<blockquote>(As exactly quoted from [[User:Dan56|Dan56]]) "Thank you for your contributions to articles like [[How I Got Over (album)|How I Got Over]], but the source you used is a bit questionable. Editors in the past have pointed out that Allmusic's sidebar is often incongruous with the reviewer's prose (possibly not the reviewer's choice), including at [[Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Albums/Archive_36#Allmusic.27s_genre_sidebar|WP:ALBUMS]] and [[Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard/Archive_130#Sidebox.|RSN]]. A perfect example is [[Rhythm Killers]] and its [http://www.allmusic.com/album/rhythm-killers-mw0000191861 entry] at Allmusic; the sidebar lists it as "reggae", but the reviewer observes "no reggae in sight really". If this is the only source available for a certain article, then it's fine, but more explicit, authored sources are preferred." [[User:Dan56|Dan56]] ([[User talk:Dan56|talk]]) 17:51, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

</blockquote>

:::::If the Allmusic review itself (''the text'' not the sidebar) indicated that the band was primarily a "pop rock" or "electronic" band, I'd not intervene with your edit at the first place. [[User:Myxomatosis57|Myxomatosis75]] ([[User talk:Myxomatosis57|talk]]) 21:54, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

::::::And if you READ the review that is cited it is stated IN the review itself. Therefore it's valid/reliable nonetheless. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 22:00, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

:::::::I've read the review and I can't find any mention of "pop rock" and solely "electronic" in the review. "The dark electronica" term which is used, while being subtle, can open something new for the discussion though. [[User:Myxomatosis57|Myxomatosis75]] ([[User talk:Myxomatosis57|talk]]) 22:09, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

::::::::Interesting as the word electronic is in the review 4 times. 1) "Korn remembered who they were just in time to forget it all again on The Path of Totality, an unexpected left turn into dubstep and all manner of dark electronica from the kings of nu metal." 2) "Korn always emphasized texture over riffs, so shifting from a gray guitar grind toward claustrophobic electronic collage doesn’t induce shock, apart from the shock that the album actually works." 3) "The difference of arrangement -- heavy on skittish drums and electro walls of assault -- has the curious effect of making Korn seem not adventurous but rather mature: the content of Jonathan Davis’ rants matter less than his tone, and the producers have folded his vocals, along with Munky’s buzzing guitar, into a web that feels like Korn even if it doesn’t strictly sound like any other Korn album, not even the industrial-funk of See You on the Other Side." 4)"Despite all the electronics, there’s no mistaking The Path of Totality as a Korn album...and one of their better ones to boot." As for the pop rock, no it's not in the review. For anyone that wants to put their thoughts into this, here's the link to the article in question: http://www.allmusic.com/album/the-path-of-totality-mw0002235657 Additionally, take a look at Korn's Billboard Chart History: http://www.billboard.com/#/artist/korn/chart-history/1820890 Rock, Dance, Club, Electronic, Alternative, and Hard Rock. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 22:29, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

:::::::::Yeah, the term electronic is used for 3 times but ''in order to indicate the elements in the album and describe the type of musical instruments used ([[electronic musical instrument]])'', rather than to describe the genre they're playing most ''often''. As far as I can see, besides the defunct sidebar, nothing '''explicitly''' brands Korn as an electronic music band in that review and it is really hard to decide on a band's genre by considering just an album review, especially for an one that changes its style too frequently. If they pursue on their "dubstep influenced-metal" genre for their next albums, "electronic music" branding will be valid. However, it is too early to include that on the infobox for now. And, about the Billboard issue, I'd like to say that the charts does not necessarily indicate the bands' (or even the songs') genre. Their only album that has been charted in "electronic" charts is Path of Totatily, their latest work. Apart from that, only 5 songs of Korn has received a dance/club charting; one of them being from Path of Totatily. Nevertheless, [[Nine Inch Nails]]' [[The Hand That Feeds]] also [http://web.archive.org/web/20071011144359/http://billboard.com/bbcom/esearch/searchResult.jsp?No=0&Ntt=nine+inch+nails&Ntk=Keyword&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&an=bbcom&Ex=1&N=37&Ns=FORMATTED_DATE received charting] from dance charts and their next song [[Every Day Is Exactly the Same]] even topped [[Hot Dance Singles Sales]], despite not being solely electronic or dance music. [[User:Myxomatosis57|Myxomatosis75]] ([[User talk:Myxomatosis57|talk]]) 16:04, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

::::::::::Whoops, didn't realize there was an ongoing discussion here before my last edit. It is important to put things in context here. I think the general consensus is to not include too many genres in an artist's infobox, but stick to a middle ground between too precise and too vague, such that it's possible to differentiate their sound without going into a sub-sub-sub-sub-genre of two bands. Pop rock is probably the vaguest genre name extent, and doesn't provide useful information. As for electronic, since you're citing the review for an individual album, that would be more appropriate to use as a source for that album, not for the band in its entirety. If you can find a bio on the group describing them as electronic, that would be more acceptable. —<B>[[User:Torchiest|Torchiest]]</B> ^{[[User talk:Torchiest|talk]]}<sub style="margin-left:-3ex;">[[Special:Contributions/Torchiest|edits]]</sub> 18:25, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

:::::::::And the reference to Korn as "industrial metal" isn't valid or reliable either. This article is clearly only speaking about another band and I would have to say that Korn are not and have never been and "industrial metal" band. "STRIKE-O-MATICS SEEK HELP ON NEW CD COVER Taking a cue from industrial metal act Korn, the Strike-O-Matics are seeking the assistance of their fans in designing the cover for their upcoming compact disc." As you have stated clearly, "heavy metal" is a genre of "rock music" and "nu metal is a sub-genre of "heavy metal" just as "industrial metal" is also a sub-genre of "heavy metal". So even by that logic, only "heavy metal" should be listed since you don't want to delve into sub-genre's. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 19:28, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

I do not believe Korn are industrial metal, since they are nu metal, which is an amalgamation of genres, including industrial. Calling Korn industrial metal is like saying alternative bands like Pearl Jam and Radiohead are post-punk because they are influenced by it, which is wrong since they play alt rock, which is a derivative of post-punk. I call the big one bitey 12:39, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

== Formation ==

The formation was 199'''2'''. NOT 199'''3'''. Please carefully read the sources. Find this quote saying "Formed

199'''2''' in Bakersfield, CA " over on this [http://www.allmusic.com/artist/korn-mn0000112789 source]. Notice how it says 199'''2'''?

[http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1497313/brian-head-welch-leaves-korn.jhtml On this one] find the quote saying "Korn formed in 199'''2''' as the Bakersfield metal act LAPD"

[http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2007-08-06/news/0708060494_1_james-munky-shaffer-korn-family-values-tour On this one] find the quote saying "The pace is unrelenting, but Korn is used to it by now. Formed in 199'''2''', the California band spent its early years honing its chops on the road in a succession of opening gigs for the likes of Ozzy Osbourne, Marilyn Manson and Megadeth."

Notice how they all say 199'''2''', '''not''' 199'''3'''? It specifically says it was in 199'''2'''

Any edits reverting that will be considered vandalism

[[User:Ihy34|Ihy34]] ([[User talk:Ihy34|talk]]) 00:47, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

::Edit changing the date are only vandalism if they are a deliberate attempt at compromising the article. These seem like good faith edits to improve the article, this a content dispute not vandalism. [[User:GB fan|GB]]&nbsp;[[User talk:GB fan|fan]] 02:51, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

LAPD formed in 1992...KORN didn't form till 1993. Sometimes articles use 1992 because that's when LAPD started. But that was not when Korn started. LAPD changed their name to Creep and then when they found Jonathan Davis in 1993...they changed their name to Korn and Korn was born! There is nothing to argue here, these are the facts. Your sources used the date of the birth of LAPD not Korn! I can find many other sources that will dispute this date. Please read the Wikipedia policy on ownership of articles before you being this edit warring. [[WP:OWN]] Thank you! [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 00:53, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

ACTUALLY [[L.A.P.D. (band)|LAPD]] formed in '''1989'''.<ref name="allmusic band">Torreano, Bradley [{{Allmusic|class=artist|id=p13443|pure_url=yes}} allmusic ((( L.A.P.D. > Overview )))] Allmusic. Retrieved 2010-05-11</ref>

If the sources say 1992, then it is 1992. Jonathan joined in 1992 or 1993 beginning. Could be they formed as an instrumental first just to find a singer and jonathan joined, so therefore, it's 1992. Also, I removed vandalism. Because 1992 is the formation year.

[[User:Ihy34|Ihy34]] ([[User talk:Ihy34|talk]]) 02:33, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

:No...Jonathan didn't join the band till 1993. NO article out there disputes that! Korn was formed in 1993...their first EP came out in Oct 1993. And for the record, you apparently don't understand what a consensus is. And you also are participating in an edit war. Consider this a warning. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 02:36, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

Well if Jonathan joined in 1993, still they say they formed in 1992, but got their singer in 93. Some bands begin off without a singer, then get one.

[[User:Ihy34|Ihy34]] ([[User talk:Ihy34|talk]]) 02:39, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

:No they had a singer in LAPD. Richard Morrill, Pete Capra, and Corey...James and Brian found Jonathan signing in a bar in Bakersfield in 1993. Soon after Jonathan joined the band they changed the name to Korn. Prior to that it was Creep. [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 02:52, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

:[[User:Ihy34|Ihy34]] you really should use this talk page to settle the dispute rather than the article itself with the edit warring you and [[User:Teresa44|Teresa44]] partook of. You requested a consensus and then you refuse to participate in the consensus and stop the edit warring. Now, on to this dispute. In an issue of Meanstreet Magazine from October 1993 it talks about Korn and referred to them as "the six-month old band" which means that they were formed in March/April of 1993. [http://www.angelfire.com/band/KoRnMemorabilia/korn2.htm] This is a reputable source that documented them right from the beginning. Regardless of the sites you find that say 1992, that was LAPD and Creep, NOT Korn.

:Here's several other soruces that state Korn formed in 1993:

:Marquee Magazine - [http://marqueemag.com/2010/07/01/korn/]

:Discogs - [http://www.discogs.com/artist/Korn]

:Antelope Audio - [http://www.antelopeaudio.com/en/artist/jonathan-davis-korn]

:Loudwire - [http://loudwire.com/favorite-korn-single-readers-poll/], [http://loudwire.com/tags/korn/page/5/]

:TC Electronic - [http://www.tcelectronic.com/james-munky-shaffer/]

:IMP Magazine - [http://lmpmagazine.com/2011/11/30/music-korn-the-path-of-totality-special-edition-review/]

:Roadrunner Records - [http://www.roadrunnerrecords.com/news/korn-discuss-korn-iii-remember-who-you-are]

:Roadrunner Records Canada video - [http://ca.roadrunnerrecords.com/news/korn-bring-fans-together]

:And for the final proof...their official merchandise store states the following: "Hailing from Bakersfield, California, Korn formed in 1993." [http://korn.com/] Are you actually going to dispute the band themselves on when they considered themselves to be a band? What more proof and sources do you want? Ultimately the right answer is 1993, even according to Korn. So why do you hold on to 1992 even when the band themselves say 1993? Here's another one that is OFFICIAL FROM KORN, their publicist has their biography posted as well, and it says....1993! [http://www.msopr.com/n/client-roster/korn/] [[User:Nbcwd|Nbcwd]] ([[User talk:Nbcwd|talk]]) 14:29, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

This is the guy that got me blocked from Korn's page for constantly changing it back to 1993. He's really stubborn and misinformed. Keep up the good fight guys, someone block him for me please.[[User:Teresa44|Teresa44]] ([[User talk:Teresa44|talk]]) 22:18, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

: Off-topic comments: First, [[:WP:NPA|please discuss content, not contributors]]. Second, if you're topic banned, you might want to avoid the talk page of said topic as well. --[[User:Walter Görlitz|Walter Görlitz]] ([[User talk:Walter Görlitz|talk]]) 22:22, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

==Notes==

{{reflist}}

== Inclusion of Brian Head Welch ==

Is he officially rejoined? I see he did not YET. Therefore why is he listed as one of the current members in the top right corner??